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Home›Match Previews›Let the Games Begin: Arsenal v Porto Match Preview (CL)

Let the Games Begin: Arsenal v Porto Match Preview (CL)

By Michael Price
February 17, 2010
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Champion's League Knockout Stages RETURN!!!

Champion's League Knockout Stages RETURN!!!

 

They’re here! That’s right kiddies the Champion’s League knock out stages are back and they have already given us some tasty delights. But none of that concerns us – all Gooner’s eyes are squarely focused on the Arsenal trip way down Portgual way.

Arsene Wenger’s boys meet up on the pitch of Estadio do Dragao to square off against Jesualdo Ferreira’s FC Porto. Like their English opponents they currently sit third in their league and have been having an up and down season.

Arsenal and Porto met last year in the Champion’s League group stages – in their last meeting – the last of the group – Porto scored a brace to win the Group. However, when the first match day was played at the Emirates, Arsenal unloaded for 4 and giving up none. Previous to that Arsenal took both legs from a 2006/2007 meeting.

Porto see the return of Hulk to the lineup who has been suspended from the league since 20 December. They will be without the services of playmaker and recent signing Reuben Micael and his loss could be felt by the home side. Like Arsenal, Porto are stuggling to find attackers and their only healthy Forward – Radamael Falcao will lead the attack.

From everything out there it looks like Porto have been watching Chelsea and United for their inspiration on how to attack Arsenal. The question is do they have the personnel to do it. Porto like Arsenal are well coached and have excellent scouts supporting the team and they are up on the Gunner’s recent plights.

Given their oppeness of play however, the game should be less like the bruising roughness of an EPL match and should be more of a tactician’s delight.

This is the one trophy Arsenal hasn’t won in his tenure at Arsenal and by all means it looks like it is where he has placed all his eggs. Yes, it would be great to win the EPL with a squad as technically gifted as he has now. Whether that is realistic given the nature of the league is another issue. But Europe is where Arsenal fit in more than they do on their home soil (it is also why I believe Arsenal wouldn’t shy away from a Europe Super League – but I digress). His team is to a lesser extent modelled after Barca. His change to the 4-3-3 was a direct result of Barca’s success with the formation. And while they do not have identical talent the talent bases are similar to some extent. Arsenal need to make hay and they have a hard road ahead but it is not one that is difficult just one frought with dangers.

The club head to Portugal with some short-term additions to the training table, Arshavin, Song, Almunia, and Gallas all did not make the trip as did the normal cast of characters. Deputizing should be Sol Campbell who is making his return to CL play since 2006 – you might remember what he did that year. Fabianksi will get the nod in goal and is hoping to re-impress the gaffer and ply for more starts (we all hope that works for ya Fabs – really). Starting in place of Song is unknown but I think a surprise could be in the offering and we could see a baptism by fire in this match.

I don’t think our favorite Brazillian will be the midfield replacement for Song. Denilson it seems may have finally lost favor with the boss. He will get sniffs but his laxidasical play noticed by the known world (Gooners at least) could not have been missed by the boss and the Brazillian has not had a start or even a subbed role. That is usually the sign that something rotten in Demark this way comes.

The Gunners have some confidence coming into this match having seemingly righted their ship and plotted a course back into the EPL title chase. Whether they have a realistic shot of winning is for another discussion. Their hard fought win against a cagey opponent got them focused again. Additionally, the healthy portion of the squad has had a full week’s rest while their opponent played during the weekend.

The European game is more suited to how Arsenal play. It is less about physicallity and more about openess and precision – epitomized by Barca. Arsenal are looking to go as deep as they can with their style leading the way. Porto are committed to playing an open game but being armed with the information they have – you wonder whether or not that will last.

Arsenal are strong enough to own this match but given the injuries and the away match being stuck on it – it would not be surprising to see a draw.

How the Match Should Play Out:

This is a difficult match to call since both sides have had issues of late and both are reeling from injuries. Porto have lost their last two matches against English sides (Chelsea and United). They have seen what those two sides have done Arsenal and will look to do a semblance of that to the Gunners – however that equates to a continental side. Arsenal are going to lean heavily on their ace in the whole Fabregas for whom playing in Europe is ideally suited. He will push the attack and command the ball and likely open up the match for some of the other players. But realistically with all the short-term injuries to the squad I think Arsenal will be trying to come away from Porto with a draw.

Players to Watch:
Arsenal: Fabregas. The lad is made for Euro football and the style of play suits him well. Look for a break out season this CL year.

Porto: Hulk. When you have a name like Hulk it begs you to be watched.

Injuries:
Arsenal: Almunia, Arshavin, Song, Gallas, Eduardo, Djourou, Gibbs, van Persie,

Porto: Farias, Micael, Rodriguez, Sa,

Probable Starting XI:
Arsenal: Fabianski, Campbell, Vermaelen, Sagna, Clichy, Diaby, Nasri, Fabregas, Rosicky, Walcott, Bendtner

Porto:Helton, Lopes, Rolando, Alves, Fucile, Fernando, Belluschi , Costa, Mariano, Falcao, Hulk

TV Broadcasts:
US: FSC 2:30PM

UK: ITV 1930

Online Feeds:
www.iraqgoals.net

www.atdhe.net

www.justin.tv

www.myp2p.eu

Gameday Chat will be open: www.youaremyarsenal.com/gamedaychat

YAMA Prediction:
Arsenal – 1
Porto – 1

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85 comments

  1. Valentina Elieff 23 February, 2012 at 22:32 Log in to Reply

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  4. etycoon ryan moran 23 August, 2011 at 22:21 Log in to Reply

    Wonderful content. I don’t quite totally agree with all the things you’ve went over, but you surely have some good points in there.

  5. joshuad 19 February, 2010 at 22:30 Log in to Reply

    Vibe4arsenal, I, like everyone else here, come on this site to talk about Arsenal football. For some reason you seem to comment on my EVERY SINGLE POST in a poor attempt to undermine whatever I say. I typically don’t reply to your comments because you simply don’t have anything relevant to say about football. You just like talking about joshuad.

    We’re all grown men that come here to talk football. If you don’t like what I post, there’s no need to reply. I won’t be offended. But atleast I know how Eminem feels now that I’ve got my very own psycho-ass Stan.

    • vibe4arsenal 20 February, 2010 at 02:01 Log in to Reply

      Josh, you flatter yourself, just as you do with your knowledge of the game. You make grand pronouncements, that you fail to back up. When asked for alternative theories your stadium alibi, both stagg and I responded, and you folded up. After thinking so much of your GDC commentary, you repeat here, then contradict on the very same thread. ‘Wenger knows best which players to play’/’Nasri has Wenger fooled.’

      You outed yourself, explicitly and implicitly, as ‘not smart’ on this very thread. I’m content to leave it at that.

      Hope we all get a good result tomorrow. Peace out, homie.

    • HighburyterraceSteve 20 February, 2010 at 11:49 Log in to Reply

      On a related note….Dido (sampled by Eminem on “Stan”) is a life-long Arsenal fan….

      Can’t we all just get along?….

  6. arsesession 19 February, 2010 at 15:14 Log in to Reply

    I’ve been watching segments of the Olympics. What I’ve noticed is for every competition (not team oriented), the youngest contestants CONSISTENTLY have a lapse in their performance. The more experienced always maintain a level of composure & consistency and are in the medal hunt.

    I was glued to the set to see Shaun White. To me, he’s like a athletic rarity. (like Larry Bird, Michael Jordan, Tiger Woods, Lance Armstrong to their respective sports)

    So he was being interviewed at the bottom of the half-pipe (dressed, ready to compete); and the announcer made some remark about how calm he was or was he expecting an easy gold medal – and he looked into the camera and said “are you kidding, this is the Olympics” (sorry – something to that effect).

    So after watching the Porto match, I did not feel the world had come to an end. No need to embellish the technical and mental mistakes our team made.

    There is a reason why goalkeepers reach their prime after 30. By the way, I thought Cesc was rubbish for 90 minutes – yes, he had a bullseye on his shirt, but he did nothing!

    Regardless of the match, I still believe Fabianski has far greater ability than Almunia. Szczesny has made a good choice to go out on loan. Much better than staying at the club and playing only in reserve matches.

    For me, the second goal is a reflection of our manager & training deficiencies. No Arsenal player reacted to the situation and in itself is horrific managing – not school yard play but poor managing.

    As an Arsenal fan, I was embarrassed.

    • stag133 19 February, 2010 at 22:13 Log in to Reply

      first of all,
      if you get hit ALL GAME LONG, it obviously will have an effect on your play. Soccer is physical, but its not supposed to be American Football.
      Cesc gets hammered, NOBODY STEPS UP and retaliates. That is a problem with TEAM.
      Are we a team? Are we a unit? Is there any solidarity?
      He’s gotta be tired of it, and it will be a factor in whether he stays or goes in the Summer, in my opinion.
      He is still, by far, the best player on the team… has captain responsibilities, and is 23.
      I have ZERO problem with Cesc.
      Mr.Diaby, with his big self, should be POLICING the midfield… what’s he do in regard to the clubs best player being hit repeatedly? FECK ALL.

      Fabianski should not be playing for the Arsenal. He showed why. Ability? I saw a scared rookie, who could not communicate with his defense properly.

      The 2nd goal, was FABIANSKI 100% f*ing up… NOBODY picks that ball up. NOBODY that’s professional. That is why Sol had his head in his hands, saying… WTF are YOU DOING?

      Ref f’d it up even more, and gave them a goal… but it starts and ends with Fabianski’s error.

      You can’t win with that type of play, and we didn’t.

  7. HighburyterraceSteve 19 February, 2010 at 11:55 Log in to Reply

    I’m struggling to take the news that Diaby has got “medial knee ligament” damage (as Song suffered vs Liverpool?) What is this injury? You play 90 minutes one game but then need a game (or two, or a month or season) off? If Song can play tomorrow (Uh, we seemed to miss him a bit in the CL match), I guess I’ll be less concerned.

    And what about hamstrings? Eduardo’s little one isn’t so little, so maybe Arshavin’s is even littler (him being shorter and all)? Last season Ade pulled his and was out for months (but happy to get his salary while watching from the stands and listening to his I-pod…and it didn’t even hurt his long-term career prospects!?!) but he’s taller so maybe that’s why it was worse?….And didn’t Ramsey do his hamstring also, but then came back too quickly? Maybe that’s why he can’t get any pitch-time?

    Obviously, a lot of questions. (Sorry?)

    The injury situation is laughable (or do we laugh to keep from crying?) as is the keeper situation. We don’t have enough offensive threat to keep a floundering team like Sunderland completely occupied so they might even try to nick a goal or two from open-play and not just rely on set-pieces. Our loss to them was their last League victory, but (if they watched us in mid-week) they might be thinking, “Arsenal…Hey, that’s the team we win against….”

    Finally, I’ve been thinking about the core of the “youth experiment”–Diaby, Denilson, Song….All three are decent enough technically, and they’re young enough to have the fitness and work-rate to give good ninety minute showings, and a couple of them were showing signs of really being able to contribute….BUT if they’re ALL hurt or coming back from injury (lacking fitness) or lacking confidence as young players getting repeatedly roached or caught out (Denilson) would tend to be, then what? I mean it’s all for the best that we didn’t destroy their confidence by buying “mature” players in those positions…but perhaps being forced to play them when they’re (physically or mentally) broken won’t help much either….

    No problem…early goal or two (for us), no crazy mistakes at the back and we’ll be fine….(Right?)

  8. joshuad 19 February, 2010 at 10:19 Log in to Reply

    Nasri’s a player with good technical ability, no doubt. The problem is he only plays for himself, holds the ball too long, and doesn’t use his ability to create.

    If you remember a few years ago, Nasri got into it with a couple of “senior players” while on international duty about his play. I speculated it was Vieira in his ass about dancing with the ball and slowing down their attacks. PV4 absolutely hates that in a player and that’s why you didn’t see it when he was the Arsenal captain. Watch Nasri tomorrow and you will see that he is anything but fluid. He’s got Wenger fooled.

    Two years ago, Adebayor had Hleb creating and releasing the ball quickly, which made him effective. Last year, with Nasri’s slow delivery, Ade grew frustrated making runs for nothing because Nasri decided to hold the ball for no apparent reason. This gives teams the opportunity to get back in defense. So many were going on about how much of an upgrade Nasri was to Hleb because he scored a few goals early last season. With Hleb on the pitch, while he didn’t score, he created scoring chances by the boat.

    Early in the season, people were talking about how Arsenal were on course to smash the goal-scoring record. That also happened to be the time when Nasri was out with a broken leg. With Nasri fit again, we’re suddenly struggling to even create chances let alone score. Is it a coincidence? Please. Nasri gives us no product.

    Give me Eboue. Atleast he will run at people and try to link play and create chances.

    • HighburyterraceSteve 19 February, 2010 at 11:10 Log in to Reply

      Strong point (and posted twice for emphasis….) I was going to suggest that it was Nasri’s lack of physical presence and pace. Players at least have to create a “threat” which causes defenders to “worry” about them a bit, giving space to their teammates. This might explain Diaby’s better appearance in the stats above.

      Nasri, like Arshavin, IS opportunistic and, generally, takes his chances well. Those two are our two most recent offensive signings (and not cheap at 13 and 18 million pounds, or thereabouts, each). It has been argued that both were essentially signed to replace Hleb, which, if true, says a lot about how we’ve been treading water these past couple of seasons. It might also suggest that they shouldn’t be on the pitch simultaneously (not a problem if one is injured, i.e., for tomorrow’s match).

      I’ll second the call for Eboue as a makeshift forward, despite his lack of finishing quality (to be expected in a right back) and poor discipline, and assorted antics….but I’d wager he’ll get Rosicky’s spot on the right and Nasri will start on the left….

      • stag133 19 February, 2010 at 13:26 Log in to Reply

        Eboue does nothing for me. He’s a good back-up, and if he plays, I prefer him at right back.

        Why would we have a “make-shift” forward with a LACK OF FINISHING QUALITY, in our team regularly?
        (he SUCKS at shooting, can’t hit the net at all)

        His diving – poor discipline… unacceptable in my eyes. I cringe when he’s on the pitch.

        That’s the problem in a nutshell, we’ve got Eboue as an option. Where have you gone Freddie Ljungberg?

        • joshuad 19 February, 2010 at 14:27

          Sure, Eboue is not a big goal threat but neither was Hleb. However, we still managed to be a more potent attacking team that created more chances when Hleb was on the pitch than not. Nasri only scores when everything lines up perfectly for him.

          Eboue won’t look to hold the ball and let opponents get their shape. He will look to counter quickly. He will look to link play. He will look to run at a defender. He will look to be direct. He will not be so predictable. He can and will provide a spark to our lethargic attack.

          No one else in the team can do this to as good effect as Eboue; certainly not Walcott or Nasri. It is a shame that our back-up fullback is a better option than those two. It’s also no mystery that good teams show a genuine interest in him every summer but no one cares about Walcott or Nasri.

          If Eboue goes on a dribble and beats a man, even though he’s no great goal threat, someone still has to move out of position and challenge him. That causes the defense to lose it’s shape. It will also provide spark and momentum in the final third. That will lead to scoring chances; which is what we’re lacking. This is why I prefer Eboue to Nasri. I could be wrong but at least to give him a chance. What we’ve been doing isn’t working.

        • HighburyterraceSteve 19 February, 2010 at 16:32

          Freddie has gone to the land of people who can no longer run….(Most recent sighting was in Seattle, I think.) When I saw him in ’06, after being out injured for half the season, I was shocked…He was sadly off the pace and there was no coming back.

          We all know about Eboue’s problems AND he may be a symptom of Wenger’s hubris–trying to take talented but “troubled” players, play them out of their traditional positions, etc.

          What’s the saying? He’s not Mr. Right, but he might be Mr. Right Now…

        • seattle gooner 19 February, 2010 at 16:40

          Seattle ;)

    • vibe4arsenal 19 February, 2010 at 14:20 Log in to Reply

      Wenger knows best which players to start, but Nasri has Wenger ‘fooled’? It sounds as if you don’t agree with the Boss’ use of Eboue to this point, either.

      It seems that Wenger is exactly as smart as you decide he is, depending on the circumstance.

      No sarcasm, real talk.

      • HighburyterraceSteve 19 February, 2010 at 16:37 Log in to Reply

        You’re completely correct here and we have every right to question (or celebrate)everything the manager or the club does.

        Be-otch (or Bitch) is both a noun AND a verb….. ;-)

    • arsesession 19 February, 2010 at 15:36 Log in to Reply

      I thought Eboue made one of our best offensive forays of the match. Took the ball to the near post, faked his man off his feet. Played the ball, flat, to a centered Cesc. Porto defender, to his credit reacted b4 Cesc.

      This is the type of aggressive play we need from of our players. Nasri is taking too long with the ball and others stop running.

      Rosicky’s play (right now) is light years above Nasri’s.

  9. joshuad 19 February, 2010 at 10:19 Log in to Reply

    Nasri’s a player with good technical ability, no doubt. The problem is he only plays for himself, holds the ball too long, and doesn’t use his ability to create.

    If you remember a few years ago, Nasri got into it with a couple of “senior players” while on international duty about his play. I speculated it was Vieira in his ass about dancing with the ball and slowing down their attacks. PV4 absolutely hates that in a player and that’s why you didn’t see it when he was the Arsenal captain. Watch Nasri tomorrow and you will see that he is anything but fluid. He’s got Wenger fooled.

    Two years ago, Adebayor had Hleb creating and releasing the ball quickly, which made him effective. Last year, with Nasri’s slow delivery, Ade grew frustrated making runs for nothing because Nasri decided to hold the ball for no apparent reason. This gives teams the opportunity to get back in defense. So many were going on about how much of an upgrade Nasri was to Hleb because he scored a few goals early last season. With Hleb on the pitch, while he didn’t score, he created scoring chances by the boat.

    Early in the season, people were talking about how Arsenal were on course to smash the goal-scoring record. That also happened to be the time when Nasri was out with a broken leg. With Nasri fit again, we’re suddenly struggling to even create chances let alone score. Is it a coincidence? Please.

    Give me Eboue. Atleast he will run at people and try to link play and create chances.

  10. nipuna 19 February, 2010 at 04:43 Log in to Reply

    Stat attack before we get back to league action this weekend. I did an analysis on which player has the best playing record for Arsenal in the league this season. Here are the numbers (only considered those who have played more than 10 games)

    Club record – Games played 26, Pts 52, Points per game 2.00, Goals for per game 2.35 and Goals against per game 1.15

    Players better than the club average

    v Persie 11 2.27 3.27 1.27
    Diaby 19 2.21 2.63 1.11
    Eduardo 12 2.17 2.50 0.92
    Arshavin 22 2.09 2.36 1.09

    Players same as club average

    Vermaelen 26 2.00 2.35 1.15
    Gallas 26 2.00 2.35 1.15
    Fabregas 21 2.00 2.29 1.19

    Players worse than club average

    Almunia 21 1.86 2.14 1.19
    Song 19 1.84 2.26 1.26
    Sagna 22 1.82 2.27 1.27
    Denilson 13 1.77 2.31 1.46
    Clichy 13 1.77 2.38 1.38
    Nasri 12 1.67 1.58 1.17

    * Surprised to see Diaby at #2. I guess we do well when he plays well.

    * Only Arsh and Diaby have positive records in all departments.

    * TV5 and Billy share club average because they have played all league games

    * Not surprised to see the three much maligned players (Mooney, Clichy and Deni) in the below club average

    * How does Sagna appear in the lower half? Well, the four league games in which he was “rested” were all home games against weaker opposition (Hull, Pompey, Birmingham and Pool) resulting in all wins.

    * Probably, Nasri is the biggest surprise. Absolute bottom, we do not fare well when he starts.

    Thoughts?

    • HighburyterraceSteve 19 February, 2010 at 11:24 Log in to Reply

      Good work here and it would be interesting if you included ALL the players and all the matches (not just league games) as some of the extremes might be interesting…i.e. Fabianski, Walcott?

      If you did it this way you’d have to create make believe “points” to summarize our (rather disastrous) cup runs, which SHOULD be positive, stat-building opportunities for our younger/fringe players, i.e., in normal circumstances they would tend to skew the stats in favor of our “up-and-coming players” at the expense of the “first 11”

      It also might be interesting if you could sort by minutes played to find just how many goals we’re able to score/concede and points we’re able to pick up based on actual pitch time.

      Thoughts on a few individuals are below.

      Again, good work, Nip…Also, would you care to guarantee victory vs Sunderland tomorrow or Porto in the return leg of the CL tie?… You most certainly increased my (currently flagging) confidence before the Liverpool match. :-)

  11. nipuna 19 February, 2010 at 01:06 Log in to Reply

    http://www.football365.com/story/0,17033,8751_5957950,00.html

  12. DaAdminGooner 18 February, 2010 at 18:24 Log in to Reply

    Interesting read by Dermot Gallagher (former EPL ref) best summary of how I think everyone felt about the second goal:

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/leagues/premierleague/arsenal/7265937/Dermot-Gallagher-says-Portos-controversial-winning-goal-against-Arsenal-was-strange.html

    • stag133 19 February, 2010 at 00:05 Log in to Reply

      I think we all agree that it was a bizarre scenario.

      I think we can also all agree that Fabianski f*cked the play up, and most school boy keepers would know not to pick up that ball, but to boot it away.

  13. joshuad 18 February, 2010 at 16:10 Log in to Reply

    I’m not a so-called kool-aid man or whatever you guys call it. But with our current situation, I do try to come here and say positive things; sort of a devil’s advocate. You don’t have to be clever to say something negative. People will always have some bullshit to say, especially when things are bad.

    With that, understand that I am not Arsene Wenger. This is not my club. I haven’t made a single decision and have no special insight. I have no definitive answers, just a couple of wild guesses. I’m just a fan.

    Those who know me from the old site know that I’ve disagreed with Wenger’s decisions on numerous occasions from making Henry captain to not playing big-game Reyes in the Barcelona game. But I’ve always supported the boss. I believe he’s doing what he feels is best for the future of Arsenal. I don’t want the financial predicament of Man United or Liverpool. Likewise, I don’t want the sugar-daddy’s of Chelsea or Manchester City.

    We all know why I think Wenger’s transfer policy changed. I’ve heard you all repeat it with a sarcastic tone. Well, I’ll be the first to admit that, being a country hick from Jacksonville, I ain’t that smart. Can someone tell me a more logical reason why Wenger would change his policy that’s won him so much silverware? No sarcasm though, just real talk from smart dudes.

    • vibe4arsenal 18 February, 2010 at 16:46 Log in to Reply

      Another theory would be that he’s a stubborn, proud man with a point he wanted to prove.

      In a few words, The Youth Experiment. He loves his reputation as a finder of talent and champion of beautiful football. He literally wanted to build a legacy, from the ground up. Once the last of the Invicibles was out, and the board firmly on his side, the path was clear.

      Since our wages remain high, and contracts long, even without high-dollar/profile new signings–in addition to at least a solid profit picture–this makes more sense to me than the stadium alibi. Financial prudence is part of it only in that he’s proud of his Masters In Economics and it makes another point of difference from the over-leveraged fat-cats and sugar daddies.

      Thus far he’s proved that he can build and manage a third place club like no other.

    • stag133 18 February, 2010 at 17:13 Log in to Reply

      I will agree with Vibe. It is personal. He is stubborn, and arrogant, and believes he can win without having to bring in proven talent, can win without having star players on the team, can win with LESS.
      He will NOT change no matter what, he does not adapt and change his tactics nor his “plan”, no matter what reality says.
      Instead… he makes excuses, as to why his teams don’t win.
      Other teams don’t play football correctly, they play anti-football… whatever excuse works for his story that week.

      Would I love us to BUY a star player or two, YES. I would, but I think that all of us agree that he doesn’t have to spend like Man City to improve the team.

      Either the board is lying to us every single season, saying there is money to spend if Wenger wants to… or Wenger is incapable of seeing the forest thru the trees.

  14. stag133 18 February, 2010 at 12:43 Log in to Reply

    so in watching yesterday’s match…
    here are a few key areas it appears we need to address:
    KEEPER
    DM
    STRIKER
    (and we could use some speed on the wing)

    So, absolutely nothing has changed, Wenger has had the
    chance to address these in the Summer and January, and
    steadfastly refused… and EVERYBODY knew the problem areas.

    In most jobs, that would be negligence, and grounds for FIRING.

  15. DaAdminGooner 18 February, 2010 at 11:33 Log in to Reply

    If this doesn’t say it all about our sason:

    Average percentage of shots saved is 70%. Arsenal ‘Keepers – Almunia 62.5%, Fabianski 62.1%, Mannone 66.7%.

    • HighburyterraceSteve 18 February, 2010 at 12:01 Log in to Reply

      So which one plays vs Sunderland on Saturday?

      And what of the other injuries? Do we know anything about the extent of Song’s knee problem or whether Eduardo or Arshavin will be recovered from Hamstring problems?

      Certainly, Sunderland were well organized against us in the wake of RVPs injury back in November and they should be again. We were fairly toothless in attack yesterday and without a freshening up with some returnees (or maybe even starting Eboue or something) I don’t know why we should expect much improvement.

      The frailty of the squad (with injuries and mistakes and just plain lack of evident drive) is pretty clear right now. Somehow we need to step it up.

      Denilson was poor (again) yesterday but he did inspire the woeful referee to blow his whistle by going down repeatedly in the middle of the pitch. Is that enough to force decent attacking options like Diaby back into DM or keep Aaron Ramsey on the bench?

      I want something to be hopeful about, but 3 points on Saturday would seem a long-shot….

      • DaAdminGooner 18 February, 2010 at 12:27 Log in to Reply

        Here’s something to be hopeful about – since beating Arsenal in November – Sunderland have been on the fast track downward.

        Arshavin should be back as well.

        Based on yesterday’s performance alone I think you have to go with Almunia. I’d prefer Mannone at this point but that isn’t going to happen.

  16. DaAdminGooner 18 February, 2010 at 10:34 Log in to Reply

    Well this Kool-Aid drinker (sort of) couldn’t comment because I was on flight 882 from Chicago to Boston. I did get to watch the first half and some of the second from the terminal.

    Anyway, Sol Campbell MOTM in my opinion – great saving tackles, good positioning – Sol should never have left – thats right for the short of memory – Sol left the club, he asked for the transfer – he was not sold off. All in all after 2 EPL matches and 1 CL match he certainly doesn’t look like he is done. If anything is a 100% better option as a backup to central back than silvestre has ever been.

    Secondly as for Gallas – if he leaves – he will not be sold – his contract is up. No profit to be made there.

    What freakin keeper in their right mind picks up a a ball that could be called a back pass? Really between Almunia and fabianksi there isn’t even 1/4 of a brain between the two of them. Those had to be two of the most boneheaded plays I have ever seen by a ‘keeper. The first goal – clearly a cross and if Fabs didn’t know that there wasn’t anyone near his far post he is also guilty of situational awareness.

    Someone mentioned Nasri and Rosicky on the pitch at the same time – yesterday for the first time it looked like a good combination both had some good time on the ball. Still we are being too deliberate in the development of our play and has been pointed out thats predictable and maybe some speed will help.

    Denilson should never play AGAIN. He gave away more than he took away. our weakness in the middle was evident because he doesn’t have the ability to be a holding midfielder. Our middle only tightened up slightly when Wenger moved Diaby in front of the center backs. But then it took Diaby’s presence out of the game. Song was never more needed than yesterday.

    But I want to focus on the ref for a second – Can’t blame him for Fabianski’s stupidity but two things in that play – he seems to impede Sol Campbell from getting into position and he basically pulled the away from Fabianski.

    This guy is likely to be the worst ref ever. Prior to the goal – he clearly misses the foul on Rosicky as he was crumpled over in the box. How he let that many muggings on Fabregas go on for so long was amazing. I get trying to keep play moving but he just wasnt making calls in order to not make calls.

    And finally – Porto need to do more than just not concede. With the away goal it is basically even. If Arsenal win 1-0 we go through on aggragate.

    • HighburyterraceSteve 18 February, 2010 at 12:08 Log in to Reply

      Plenty of agreement with what you’re saying…but “Porto need to do more than just not concede” ???

      Uh…If we can’t score, they go through….

      (I think we will, and we’ll get through) but I’m not sure what you mean here…

      • DaAdminGooner 18 February, 2010 at 12:38 Log in to Reply

        Actually isn’t a “draw” with the away goal? Just asking I always get confused with the away goal rule

        • HighburyterraceSteve 18 February, 2010 at 13:05

          Not sure exactly what you’re asking here….

          If the score, on aggregate, is a draw, then the team with the most away goals goes through. In other words if we win the home leg 1-0, (2-2 on aggregate) we go through (on our away goal). If they hold us 0-0, they go through on aggregate (2-1).

          Not sure if that makes it any clearer….

    • stag133 18 February, 2010 at 12:37 Log in to Reply

      you didn’t call me?! You were in Boston?!
      :)

      Wenger NUDGED Sol out the door… wasn’t going to play him much, wanted to reduce his salary.
      If Gallas leaves, we will save his large salary.
      Saving money, always a factor at Arsenal.

      So you think Denilson shouldn’t play any more? LOL
      what are our options, when you don’t address problems that most of us have stated since the season started, and AW ignored.

      School-Boy errors by Fabianski, and that’s a QUOTE from Cesc. Think he’s happy? Doubt it.
      and… that is the “Henry HandBall Ref”…
      perhaps he should be changing careers soon.

      But we didn’t deserve to win. That’s just a fact. Porto would have been crushed by a good team, playing well.

      If Porto score a goal, and we RARELY keep a clean sheet, we’ll need 3, or go to penalties.
      If they score twice, we’ll need 4.

      The advantage is definitely Porto’s. They don’t have to do anything. 0-0 and they go thru.

      • DaAdminGooner 18 February, 2010 at 12:39 Log in to Reply

        I am in Boston all day today

      • DaAdminGooner 18 February, 2010 at 12:42 Log in to Reply

        Cesc also said “We have to be there for Fabianski” to which I want to add –

        Holding the door to the training facility as he leaves for Notts County.

        Yes the Henry Hand ball ref – should change careers NOW.

        But overall you are right Stag we didn’t play well enough to win and didn’t deserve to.

  17. joshuad 18 February, 2010 at 08:16 Log in to Reply

    My point was why Wenger persists with some players when fans think others should be playing instead. He knows his players better than we do. In fairness, my list consisted of youngsters. I think many of our young players have potential to be superstars but their time hasn’t come yet. That’s why Wenger plays some less popular players.

    Keeping things in perspective, we’ve got a lot of injuries. Almunia, van Persie, Gallas, Song, and Arshavin were all out. That’s nearly half of the starting eleven unavailable. Bar Chelsea, who else can consistently win games with that many injuries? Barcelona had that many injuires and Atletico handed them their asses last weekend.

    As for why Wenger does business like he does, well you’ll have to ask Wenger.

    • stag133 18 February, 2010 at 12:30 Log in to Reply

      two points:

      there are ZERO superstars in our team (or players who can become superstars), and only Cesc can become one, but it will be at Barcelona.

      and…
      Barcelona lost to Atletico, however, I don’t believe their manager belittled Atletico’s style of play, called them lucky, blamed the refs, or that they play anti-football.
      He said… they were the better team today.

      You would NEVER hear that from Wenger, always bullshit excuses. That’s the difference.

      Class instead of arrogance.

    • vibe4arsenal 18 February, 2010 at 13:11 Log in to Reply

      “That’s why Wenger plays some less popular players.”

      Love the phrase ‘less popular players’. As if they’re judged by personality.

      Those would be the ‘crap’ players you’re euphemistically referring to. And as you apparently explained on GDC, Wenger plays these crap players, because those behind them have even less business playing for first team Arsenal.

      So Wenger’s genius is being able to sift through the garbage/unrealized greatness he’s signed to long-term contracts?

      “As for why Wenger does business like he does, well you’ll have to ask Wenger.”

      Why do we need to ask him? You’ve explained, more than once, that the transfer policy is down to the new stadium. (Because it’s the only thing that makes sense to you.)

      How we have the 4th largest wage bill and so many players who can’t play for AFC, well, do we need to be on GDC to have that explained?

  18. joshuad 18 February, 2010 at 02:00 Log in to Reply

    To reiterate points I made on GDC; for everyone wondering why Wenger plays Almunia over Fabianski, now you know. I’m sure the same applies for Vela, Wilshire, Ramsey, Merida, and everyone else we bitch Wenger out about not playing them.

    Did you guys see Sol’s grin as he was lined up on the pitch while the Champions League music was playing? Surely, he thought he’d never experience that again. As for the goal, Gallas puts that ball over the bar. Well done, Sol.

    The book has been written on how to beat Arsenal. It goes something like this, get behind the ball quickly because they’re so slow to attack, and counnter-attack with pace and conviction. In fairness, we gave them their goals but that’s how a tournament goes. The best team doesn’t always win and the team that makes mistakes at this level gets punished. Hopefully we can impose our will and score a goal.

    We don’t need to start Nasri and Rosicky at the same time. They provide us with no pace. We should start either Eboue or Walcott every game for the rest of the season. We’re too slow and predictable. I prefer Rosicky and Eboue. Nasri reminds me of this kid I knew in college because he takes a lot of touches but does whole lot of nothing with it. If Vieira were still here, he’d kick the crap out of Nasri for that.

    I’m not sure we’ll go through. All they’ve got to do is not concede and we’re out. Our attack looks impotent at best, which is why all I wanted in January was a striker. We should have signed Pavlyuchenko from Spurs on loan. We could have gotten him. He’s a mobile striker with good technique, descent pace, he’s not cup tied, he wouldn’t have had to move, and he’s known Arshavin for years. I’ve always liked Pav, but just like Bent, Crouch, Jenas, Zokora, Kaboul, Bentley, Kanoute, Dalmat, and numerous others, their game seemed to bottom when they wore scum’s shirt. We’ll see if Wenger’s decision cost’s us.

    • stag133 18 February, 2010 at 02:27 Log in to Reply

      You don’t really believe Spurs would LOAN us a player, do you?
      Would NEVER happen in a million years.

    • vibe4arsenal 18 February, 2010 at 02:27 Log in to Reply

      Yes, Fabianski sucks worse than Almunia. Thanks for that.

      Were you able to explain on GDC why this is all Wenger has as Arsenal’s GKs? After a couple of years now? Because then you’d be telling us something that we don’t know.

      Oh, wait. Yeah, the stadium. That’s why we have terrible keepers. Got it.

    • CaribKid 18 February, 2010 at 06:36 Log in to Reply

      “To reiterate points I made on GDC; for everyone wondering why Wenger plays Almunia over Fabianski, now you know. I’m sure the same applies for Vela, Wilshire, Ramsey, Merida, and everyone else we bitch Wenger out about not playing them.”

      What does that comment say about Wenger? Does that mean we have a host of well paid players signed to long term contracts who can’t contribute.

      Does that statement mean we do not have a quality squad although having the 4th highest payroll?

      Something does not jive here.

    • stag133 18 February, 2010 at 12:27 Log in to Reply

      really glad Sol was smiling and happy at the start, I can tell you he wasn’t too happy after either goal… he’s playing with a keeper who shouldn’t be in the league.

  19. nipuna 18 February, 2010 at 01:25 Log in to Reply

    Amidst all the display of inabilities and disabilities, Arsenal are not out of this tie. The away goal gives us hope and we should be able to put Porto to sword on the basis of our strong home record. We do need a two goal cushion and since we are totally unable to keep clean sheets, we may need three goals. Still there is hope.

    But as Steve points out, with such displays there is only so far one can go in this competition.

    • stag133 18 February, 2010 at 01:36 Log in to Reply

      Nip, I agree with the assessment of “this tie”.
      We SHOULD beat Porto at home.
      But in the grand scheme of things, does that really matter? It only means another 2 matches in the CL, and more money in the till with the gate.
      A good team, would have beaten Porto and gone home with the tie not even in doubt.
      Heaven forbid Porto score first at the Emirates, on a fluke goal or defensive feck-up.
      We are a fragile bunch, who do not deal with any type of stress well.

      Do you think they’re gonna foul Cesc all over the pitch again? You know it, and what will we do?
      FECK ALL.
      We’ll take it.
      Who’s in net? Nobody we can trust to make a save when it counts.

      Can’t win this way… there is limited hope, that we will get to the Qtrs… but ZERO chance of winning this competition.

    • vibe4arsenal 18 February, 2010 at 13:00 Log in to Reply

      ” with such displays there is only so far one can go in this competition.”

      But, hey, we’re competitive! ;-)

      • armchairfan 18 February, 2010 at 13:28 Log in to Reply

        We lost, but we also almost won it ;)

  20. nipuna 18 February, 2010 at 00:39 Log in to Reply

    Always thought that Fabianski could not get worse than Mooney. But hell, I was wrong. And both players are signed to long term contracts. Yey! Remember, even Seaman made mistakes when he was 22/23. :(

  21. ChicagoGooner 17 February, 2010 at 23:09 Log in to Reply

    With Sol getting a decent amount of match time since he came back, at the age of 35, it clearly means Arsene thinks he is good enough to play for Arsenal. A logical person would then wonder why he let him go in the first place, and think, “perhaps I shouldn’t have gotten rid of him back then… and, in fact, if it was wrong to get rid of him just because he was over 30, perhaps it was wrong to get rid of other quality players simply because they were over 30.” But Arsene is anything but logical.

    • stag133 18 February, 2010 at 00:13 Log in to Reply

      No, actually, it will probably mean that Wenger thinks its OK to sell Gallas in the Summer, and we can make a nice tidy profit on him.
      After all, that’s what counts.

  22. seattle gooner 17 February, 2010 at 22:07 Log in to Reply

    How is it possible to have two of the worst keepers in the EPL on the same team? You almost have to make a concerted effort for that to happen.

    • CaribKid 17 February, 2010 at 23:31 Log in to Reply

      How quickly you forget Mannone. 3 worst GK’s in the EPL. And lest you forget, they are all signed to long term contracts and laughing all the way to the bank.

      • seattle gooner 18 February, 2010 at 14:53 Log in to Reply

        Shit, you’re right. I forgot Don Vito.

    • armchairfan 18 February, 2010 at 02:56 Log in to Reply

      Two words: “stadium debt”

      At least that’s what I have been hearing.

      • stag133 18 February, 2010 at 12:24 Log in to Reply

        great headline, “Arsenal Stadium debt causes schoolboy errors by Fabianski”…
        explains it all!
        :)

        • armchairfan 18 February, 2010 at 13:21

          Good one. Lol :)

  23. stag133 17 February, 2010 at 19:36 Log in to Reply

    OK.
    where are all the kool-aiders today…

    how the hell can you watch this team, especially after a match
    like today, and not understand that we are just simply not good enough?

    do you really want to compare us to United or Chelsea? Seriously?

    an absolute JOKE in net… Almunia is the BEST keeper we have, and he SUCKS… it is accepted that he is NOT GOOD universally, (other than in Arsene’s world)… and Fabianski just showed how shit he is, that he
    can’t even make elementary stops.

    how can a keeper playing for ARSENAL FOOTBALL CLUB… make errors so
    bad, that you are practically begging for Almunia to get healthy…
    a HIGH SCHOOL keeper does not make the errors Fabianski made today.

    Starting with keeper… as stated previously, you can NOT win anything
    without a good one… we do NOT have one.

    I thought the defense… the back 4 that is, played OK… didn’t really
    allow decent chances, other than 2 shots at net… and Sol played just
    fine thank you, in Gallas absence.

    Going forward, we created F*CK ALL in the 2nd half… nothing of value.
    They literally took Cesc out of the match, physically… hit him all game long, and NOBODY ON THE TEAM DID SHIT ABOUT IT!!!!!!!!!!
    Are you telling me nobody can step up and put a HARD FOUL on someone,
    take a yellow card… a CRUNCHING TACKLE, to get the other team’s attention???? Does anyone on the site even remember who Patrick Vieira is?? what he did in that type of situation? GEEEEEEEEZUS H.C.
    It is embarrassing. We allow teams to hack our best player down repeatedly, with absolute ZERO repercussions…
    Where is the heart in this team?

    We did nothing much offensively against a team that played open football… and their only defensive tactic was to muscle Cesc.
    Our response?? No idea what to do…
    We have Theo, Eboue, and Vela come on… for Nasri Rosicky and Bendtner.

    Down a goal, we had defenders warming up…??

    There is just so much wrong and it is so freaking depressing to watch
    this team at times, I don’t even know where to begin or end.

    MOTM might have been Sol Campbell…
    At least I saw effort … tangible effort from him.
    No doubt MOTM for Porto was Fabianski.

    FABIANSKI, should NEVER play another first team match for Arsenal.
    Is that excessive? or going overboard?
    No, I really don’t think it is. Obviously, he can’t communicate with
    his defenders, and he can’t make even basic easy stops and decisions.
    CAN NOT PLAY AT THIS LEVEL.

    But don’t worry you kool-aiders… its all just peachy keen.
    Arsene knows. We are only down 2-1 to Porto. We’ll figure it out.
    Get the pom-poms out. Wave them around. Make the excuses.

    Gotta go drink myself into oblivion, and make believe I didn’t see
    Arsenal pre-2005.

    • HighburyterraceSteve 17 February, 2010 at 22:17 Log in to Reply

      Uh….Good Rant….How goes the drinking?

      No Kool-Aid for me, and we will need to be MUCH better (and healthier in key positions) to even have a whiff of beating the better teams in this tournament, but I am convinced we will win the 2nd leg and the overall tie.

      Porto could not take advantage of two absolutely gifted goals and put the tie out of reach with further good play and more goals against a very shaky keeper, therefore, I like our chances in the return leg. If that’s being unrealistic or over-optimistic, I apologize.

      To my mind it is completely absurd to suggest that our players should have protected Fabregas by being “hard men” on his behalf and risked picking up red or yellow cards in a match where the referee had lost control. (And we should file a protest against his conduct that led to the second goal–demanding the ball and giving it to the Porto player–this is the same ref, of course, who missed the “Hand of Henry”–How does he still work?) In fact, I think a positive of the match is that we stayed disciplined and didn’t respond to their provocations and their penchant for diving.

      I will agree that our keeper situation is pretty laughable and that Fabianski didn’t exactly “take his chance.” Hopefully, Manny is available for the Sunderland match…(just saying that is the laughable part…)

      I guess I should be glad I never saw Arsenal pre-2005 (for some reason)….Though I have seen a DVD of (all) the goals from the “invincible” year….Even that team had some “bad nights in Europe.” Also, that team is (sadly) not available for us to support at this moment….

      It WAS bad, but IMO there might be some positives in amongst the negatives (no further injuries might be one) to take forward. Sunderland, however, might be licking their lips (again!) at the prospect of playing us in our current state.

      • stag133 17 February, 2010 at 23:21 Log in to Reply

        Steve, the drinking goes… going to need MORE.

        Do you understand that you have to protect your best player(s)?
        When someone on Porto hammers Cesc, you RESPOND… you HAMMER them back, take the yellow, and send the message.

        Do you watch other sports? Hockey? Baseball? Basketball?
        If you hit Gretzky, what happened?
        If you hit Pujols with a pitch, does your best player not get hit with a pitch his next at bat?
        If you foul Kobe hard going to the basket, you know the next time one of your guys goes down the lane, he’s going down!

        This is sports 101.

        There is 1000% value in protecting your best players.
        (unless you have the finesse midget mentality of Arsenal)
        And this is why Cesc gets hit all the time, there is no response, it is just allowed by Arsenal. It won’t be allowed by Barcelona!
        ;)

    • arsesession 17 February, 2010 at 23:04 Log in to Reply

      When i watch the match later, I’ll add some balance to your usual pessimism.

      • stag133 17 February, 2010 at 23:17 Log in to Reply

        of course you will, you’ll be wearing your Arsenal Red Glasses, and you will see a completely different match!
        One in which we played well, and were unlucky to lose.
        You wear the same glasses as Arsene.

        I envy you. You can watch this shit and feel good about it.

  24. CaribKid 17 February, 2010 at 19:35 Log in to Reply

    Optimist:
    Fabianski’s performance was fantastic if you discount the 2 errors.

    Clichy played well considering he is coming back from injury and is taking one for the team

    Denilson did not contribute to any of the goals allowed, I think.

    Pragmatist:
    Time to give Szczesny a run.

    Clichy was only partially responsible for the first goal.

    Denilson’s counterpart, Gilberto Silva, was the “invisible wall”, Denilson is just invisible.

    Pessimist:
    Let’s hang all three M%^**^F&*^^er

  25. CaribKid 17 February, 2010 at 19:16 Log in to Reply

    This is the first time I will have a very difficult time picking a MOTM. Sol, Thierry, Viera and Petit all played a decent game. OOOOOPS, wrong team.

    The commentators were correct, except for the hack’a’fab tactics they were faster, technically superior and more organized than our “High School” team today. The score flatters us.

    @DAG, came in real late last night and had the article 90% ready. After today’s performance I will have some re-writing to do, but will get it to you by tomorrow.

  26. armchairfan 17 February, 2010 at 18:59 Log in to Reply

    Though 1-1 would have been better, 1-2 isn’t that bad (*if* we score and keep clean sheet at Emirates)

  27. HighburyterraceSteve 17 February, 2010 at 18:57 Log in to Reply

    A fun game to watch, for awhile until it just becomes a goal keeping and refereeing joke….

    Our best chances were from corners but Cesc couldn’t keep the ball in the box…..

    Simple passing, I guess, isn’t so simple and our team pace is woeful after all the giveaways.

    Fortunately Porto aren’t very good and a goal gets us through….Big question…Will we have some/enough decent players available for the return leg?

  28. macmac123 17 February, 2010 at 18:42 Log in to Reply

    2-1 final score. What a fucking one-man circus Fabianski is. Makes Almunia look like Pat Jennings.

    Not a disastrous result by any means. But we got a lot work to do when Porto park the bus in two weeks time.

  29. vibe4arsenal 17 February, 2010 at 17:05 Log in to Reply

    Finally, a ray of Sol. Whew.

  30. DaAdminGooner 17 February, 2010 at 16:44 Log in to Reply

    Starting XI: Fabianski, Vermaelen, Campbell, Clichy, Sagna, Denilson, Fabregas, Diaby, Nasri, Bendtner, Rosicky

    Subs: Silvestre, Eboue, Walcott, Vela, Traore, Fabianski, Ramsey

    • seattle gooner 17 February, 2010 at 16:55 Log in to Reply

      That Fabianski is amazing. He’s starting AND on the bench at the same time ;)

  31. nipuna 17 February, 2010 at 15:10 Log in to Reply

    More gems from Arsene.

    “He (Fabianski) has exceptional talent, he’s a very intelligent goalkeeper and he will have learned. Don’t forget that one of the greatest goalkeepers ever in England, David Seaman, made mistakes at 22 or 23.”

    Err…, Seaman wasn’t playing for Arsenal at 22/23. He joined at 27 and was England’s best at that time. Maybe if we signed experienced and good goalkeepers …

    “He is the best age now for a striker, at 22 you have to start to play at the top level but I would remind you that Thierry Henry arrived here at the age of 23.”

    Err…, so why aren’t we signing players in the 23+ age group?

    • stag133 17 February, 2010 at 15:59 Log in to Reply

      obviously Nip, you don’t get it.
      its the stadium debt, and Liverpool and United are going to fold soon, so don’t worry.

      :)

      • armchairfan 17 February, 2010 at 16:42 Log in to Reply

        That’s right. We have the stadium debt. We can’t buy players in 23~27years range. We simply don’t have the money.

        (whisper) *shhhhhh* we do have small change to buy the next teenage Pele for 7m. How about 2m for 9yrs old? ;)

    • vibe4arsenal 17 February, 2010 at 16:08 Log in to Reply

      DAG correctly pointed out that all Managers talk crap. But Wenger is the only one I read regularly and, holy shite, has it been flowing this season.

    • seattle gooner 17 February, 2010 at 16:54 Log in to Reply

      He never said Seaman was playing for Arsenal at the time, just that he was one of England’s best eventually.

  32. stag133 17 February, 2010 at 14:51 Log in to Reply

    I go into today’s match… like its a box of chocolates…
    I don’t know what to expect from this team, from game to game.
    My thoughts are that the Portuguese League isn’t as good as the EPL,
    so the competition shouldn’t be as strong, but that’s not always the case, is it.

    Hoping for a win, but with our line-up depleted, would be happy with
    a draw in which we score…

    I think we’ll win, 2-1.

  33. HighburyterraceSteve 17 February, 2010 at 12:17 Log in to Reply

    Thanks for the preview and for having Alex write the previous thread. I commented on it at the bottom, but I’m extremely glad we’re able to move forward with a match today. People’s views on AW and the Club become so hardened, with some actually happiest when we lose (the gloaters)…it’s depressing….

    Unfortunately today we put out a team not so different from the one we tried to sneak a win with at Stoke in the FA cup. (We’re back to a “skeleton squad” and we cannot afford any more injuries.) Hopefully our opponent plays a slightly less physical match and that the technical ability we have throughout the depth of the squad is allowed to shine. Sorry, but Denilson will start in MF, and hopefully he’ll be doing the right things…maybe his Portuguese will allow him to tell his opponents things like “hey, watch this…” or “slow down, so I can catch up with you”…. ;-)

    Fabianski could really, really use a clean sheet to match Manny’s last match and at least this time he’ll have a better group directly in front of him. Offensively, Bendtner needs to work hard and Cesc needs to have a strong match and not have too many giveaways. The team suffers mightily when he is overly aggressive. It will be interesting to see if we can dominate possession, which I think would be the way to get the result.

    Like last week, I may be a bit late getting to the GDC, but you know I’ll be pulling for the team. Huge game…We can’t win the tie today but we can make life a lot easier (or harder) for ourselves….

    • stag133 17 February, 2010 at 12:41 Log in to Reply

      Steve, I don’t think you could be further from the truth with the idea that “some actually happiest when we lose” …
      I’d say there are NONE of those.
      When you are a fan, and a fan that takes time out of his daily life, free-time, work-time, family time… to watch, read about, comment about, blog about, travel to see, pay money to support…

      You do NOT ever HOPE the team LOSES.

      I don’t believe any one of the folks on here think that way.

      A loss absolutely ruins my day, especially when its the same shit that causes it… over and over… and the same things are never addressed.

    • vibe4arsenal 17 February, 2010 at 14:58 Log in to Reply

      Steve,

      I started to say something much like this on the last thread. Since stagg has covered a chunk of it, I’ll add only this…

      Some of us have been having the same arguments for 4 or 5 years now. As time has gone on, things were matters of opinion, have hardened into matters of fact. (Arsenal’s not won anything. The Youth Experiment is not working out. We still need depth at key positions, etc.)

      And yet, somehow, the ‘realists’ (or whatever) still have a hard time getting our points conceded. So, yeah, as with any long running argument, the lesser angels of human nature pop up. If there’s any gloating, it’s over points of long, hard fought arguments being won. The tone of this often comes from frustration that people still insist on arguing against the evidence, with nothing more persuasive than “We almsot won two years ago…” and the five years running “But next year….!”

      It’s very easy to be a cheerleader, Steve. All that bouncy positivity makes everyone else look like curmudgeon by comparison.

      Much harder and less popular to be the critic. No matter how right you are, you still get called out for bitching, complaining, and “Oh, like you could do any better…”

      ‘Told you so’ isn’t pretty. But sometimes it’s the way it is, especially on an MB, were the arguments naturally become pretty simple (and the conversations here are very narrow…it’s not like we discuss pop culture and politics, too.). But ‘told you sos’ do come from both sides here. It’s just the optimists haven’t had as much opportunity recently.

      Don’t confuse (occasionally misdirected) frustration with pleasure. I would love for the way I currently see the club going to be proven wrong. There is nothing in sport I would rather see than Arsenal win…something. And nothing less I have enjoyed than the way the last 4 season have ended.

      • HighburyterraceSteve 17 February, 2010 at 19:42 Log in to Reply

        Sorry if you guys felt lumped with some of the “it’s better that we lose” crowd. I definitely have read those sentiments, and I believe that it was on this site. Again, Sorry….

        I think it’s perfectly alright to criticize individual decisions by AW and the club (I do it myself, you know) but there is no going back in time. I AM a noobie AND I would like to understand the history better. As I said at the very bottom of the last thread, it seems to me that the “Plan” has been in place for a long time AND that we had some incredible early success using veterans and younger players but centered around AW bringing in THE dominant player in the world (Henry). Since I’ve been watching the team we haven’t had that same success and I’d argue that a lot of it revolves around Henry’s fairly precipitous decline and fall. Not too many believe that he was sold pre-maturely (but I could be wrong about this).

        Also, in my opinion, we have not been AT ALL competitive with United nor Chelsea since I’ve been watching (so don’t lump me in with that crowd!…) IF we can get past Porto and beat one of those teams over two legs maybe we can claim the beginning of some competitiveness, but I’d counsel patience, i.e., on current evidence, NOT THIS YEAR… Fortunately, for the moment at least, we seem to be ahead of Liverpool and the other would-be 4th place clubs….

        But we can debate all this history and the predictions for the future at some other point (maybe if we get CaribKid’s promised analysis)….

        Again, I guess I just find the whole “Case for Wenger,” “Case against Wenger” an oversimplification and further fuel for dividing us into “camps”. For the most part everybody here IS a supporter and most everybody can see at least the general wisdom in the long-term financial approach of the club (and for better or worse, for now at least, AW IS the club). The fact of the matter is that Highbury is gone, as, unfortunately, are the sucesses from that era. We can debate WHY of course. To keep discussion going, however, we must look forward. How to do so is the question.

        • stag133 17 February, 2010 at 19:58

          I believe Henry was sold pre-maturely… as was Vieira & Pires.
          They all could have stayed a year or two more, and contributed to the team going forward.
          Maybe not as superstars, but again… Giggs/Scholes contribute to this day.

          The general wisdom of their “financial approach” goes out the window, when fans stop showing up for every match like sheep, and some stop consuming everything Arsene has to say as gospel.

          Today, is a microcosm of all that is wrong with the team.

  34. OziKenyan 17 February, 2010 at 12:16 Log in to Reply

    Score draw would be fantastic. I’ll be very happy, esp if it’s 2-2+.. I, like Nipuna, fail to see the advantage of playing at home int he second leg. I think the pressure that comes from not wanting to concede an away goal is a big disadvantage when you know you don’t have a second leg to try and reclaim it.

    Anyway, I will be on GDC tomo.. Should be able to find a stream as well.. Bring em on

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