A Dichotomy of Nations
Two teams. Similar standings in the group stages but two diametrically opposed views on their places in the standings. On one hand you have the United States quite happy with the fact that their destiny is in their own hands. And on the other you have England. England, the mother-land of football who have one World Cup title to their cabinet. England who are currently struggling to articulate why they are in the predicament they are in. Based on mind-set alone,it is England’s Yankee cousins who seem the more likely to progress out of the group stages.
So what is it? Why are there two teams who have essentially seem to be going in polar opposite directions even though they are in exactly identical situations.
Heart and Grit:
A lot has been said about the skill level of the English. These are tough players. They play in the hardest league in the world. But right now there looks to be no heart in their play. Whether it’s due to the weight of expectations or just not able to live up to the calling of such a great stage, England looked progressively worse in their first two matches. It is evident that they do not have the hear to overcome adversity. It is as if they believe the hype of the press and feel they only have to show up in order to be given a win. The problem they face is that the opposition comes to play.
When scoring first against the US, you had to think they were going to do it. But they seemed to sit back on their 1 point lead thinking they were better than the US and could hold them off. Well, after a Robert Green flub the US were back in it and the English just didn’t seem ready for that eventuality. Then when playing Algeria the English just didn’t seem to have the will to try and over come a more determined opponent. Give Algeria credit they had a plan to frustrate England and England just didn’t have it in them to counter it.
On the other hand you have the United States. Two matches in and two dramatic draws. They were one bad call away from leading the group. While there is a frustration level at the way they are starting their matches – they are showing themselves to be a determined side. They are never out and even when it looks like they are they claw back to win.
Talent and Team:
It’s very hard to understand why a team as talented as England are doing so poorly. Or is it? Remember Capello spent some time trying to get international retirees to come out and play for the squad. It has been mentioned that Capello is less than thrilled with the overall talent level of the squad. He’s got very few world-class players. Maybe two or three. But overall this is a squad that while talented may not be up to the level of the calibre in international play.
Additionally, it’s hard to see that maybe lack of heart has something to do with playing for club rather than country. People have been scratching their heads as to why the likes of Rooney, Lampard, Gerard and others do seemingly well in the EPL but struggle in international play. One of the reasons I believe is lack of focus on the international team. Yes, they are all living together and training together for their longest period of time but they are not a cohesive unit. There is no “team” it is rather a group of talented individuals who take the pitch for the World Cup. Honestly what England need is a dose of Herb Brooks. For the unitiated Herb Brooks is the man who crafted the 1980 Miracle On Ice. By making himself public enemy number one and working the team to their bones, Herb strove to first break the group of very talented college kids of their individual mindsets and build a team. A team that went on the rink and believed it could win. And when the slipped they were shredded by arch enemy number one. But because of Herb’s work and the building of a team – they went on to glory.
The England team need to identify themselves as the England Team. They miss the likes of Beckham more than anyone – because if anyone bled the red and white of St. George – it was Becks. There is noone on the current England squad who have that – who can be that unifying factor. They may progress out of the group but its hard to belive that they will do anything beyond the semis – if they get that far.
There is plenty of talent on the US side as well but not at the level of the English side. The play of the US has been bolstered by many of it’s first teamers making squads in some of the best teams in Europe. But overall you would have to say they are still a work in progress in terms of realizing their full potential. But what this group lacks in terms of talent is its team spirit. It is heads and tails above the team concept in England. They understand what this trip means for them and for their sport.
Often looked at as the bastard children of professional sports, the US Men’s National Team understands that what they accomplish on the pitch together is going to broaden the appeal of their sport and make them the catalysts for that growth. They know that this can only be accomplished by working together and focusing on each match as it comes. They seem to enjoy the adversity they are going through and veracity at the team fights back makes you pull for them all the more.
Weight of Expectations:
In few countries is the weight of expectations for its national side greater than in England. As the founding nation of the sport to achieve anything less than a final’s appearance is disaster. However, it is not a reliastic notion. This England side and many of the England sides simply do not have the skills to compete with the Brazil, Spain and Germany’s of the tournaments. Noone looking at the tournament could really say that England have a full complement of players that can get them to glory without some major chips falling their way.
Throw in the the most abusive press on the globe who on one hand laud the conquering heros (before a match played) and with the other bring them down as pirrahs and you could not blame even the strongest player in the world from wilting under the pressure. Much is made of the skills required to play the game but very little is discussed about the mental side of the game. I think the mental side of the game is the hardest to overcome. If you have skills over time even if injured they will come back. However mentally individuals are their worst enemies. Rooney has to know the expectations that are placed on him as the primary scoring threat. He seems to handle it enough for Manchester United but the stakes are bigger in the WC. Now an entire nations is supporting him and expecting him to achive – with no goals so far it is clear that he is off his game and is not in the match. Much like the rest of his team. There seems to be no joy playing for England just the stress of not doing what is expected.
For the US the greatest expectations probably come from ESPN. They spen $400 million on the rights to broadcast the World Cup. Without the US in the round of 16 the general interest by the nation will diminish. The nation as a whole is behind their national team they just don’t expect the team to do much. Beyond the sweet 16 most US supporteres might be happy they got that far – given the results of the last few world cups.
Obviously the expectations of the players are greater than the national ones. But the team does play well and seems to enjoy playing together. How that all nets out remains to be seen.
Overall, I think both teams manage to get out the group. But I won’t be surprised if come Thursday we are hearing of a manager axed and a nation in mourning.
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Stag, Cesc won’t leave because Arsene says he will not sell him. With all the speculation and Cesc supposedly saying what he has always said one day he will go to Barca he has not put in a transfer request. He may want to go this season as his good friend David Villa is there now but he is not determined to leave now, not enough to refuse to play for us.
“WHY WOULD YOU WANT HIM TO STAY?”
Because he is our best player, he has integrity and if Arsene says Cesc I want you to stay another year at least I think he will still give us his best. Even Cristiano Ronaldo gave his best in his last season for ManU.
There is one simple logic I don’t understand.
You see, when comes to intro a new ball (to please the sponsor) for the world’s major tournament, FIFA has never shy from doing it. Despite there is always a clear risk the new ball may backfire.
Yet when comes to TV review technology, they just keep on saying NO.
Now, I’m not suggesting them to try using video review in a MAJOR TOURNAMENT. How about try it in the youth games, the reserve games, the non-league games?
Just give the damn thing a TRY. If it doesn’t work, then the case is rested. If it works, it will improve the game tremendously, or, at least improve the spirit of FAIR PLAY a great deal.
But they don’t even bother to TRY? WHY?
As it stands, football – My Game is anything but FAIR PLAY.
I believe each team had the “new ball” well before the tournament started!
so there is no advantage to any team (or disadvantage)
Not using existing technology to get critical goal calls correct… is just insane. There is no explanation that makes any sense.
if you know you could correct a missed call on a goal every time, and you refuse to do so, you must want controversy.
What’s funny is that in the Mexico game, more time was spent by the ref trying to control the players after the first goal than would have been used to sort it out with a replay. It wasn’t even a close call that would have required repeat viewing.
4-2-3-1 seems to be the preferred formation in this WC.
Brazil, Spain, Holland and Germany are using it quite effectively.
Argentina has too much attacking talent to play 2 in DM.
France failed with it while England just don’t have the personnel.
I think the 4-2-3-1 is the very good blend of solidity and flexibility.
Arsenal too can play the 4-2-3-1 if Diaby is disciplined enough to stay defensive when needed (which I don’t think he is capable of) and we play intelligent players (not the likes of Theo, Eboue or Vela) as part of the attacking 3. RvP or Chamakh can be the 1.
I still feel that this Arsenal team needs another strong CM. Unfortunately, Arsene does not. :(
France, Italy & England will finally now get a much overdue turnover of their teams. All 3 teams have had aging players that were not replaced by younger competent players. Arsenal on the other hand replaced competent aging players with younger players. End result of both opposing models? Failure and poor on-field results. Ofcourse, Italy did win 4 years ago.
Maybe Wenger should be an international manager. Then the expectation is to win just every 4 years at the World Cup and the rest of the time can be spent on experimentation with youth policy. If a team fails at the World Cup, then promise to have the team ready in 4 years time :) The Euros (or Copa America, or other confederation cups) can be treated as a Carling Cup experiment in order to get ready for the main prize of the World Cup. The problem is that there is no profit league to win at the World Cup level. The profit league is always won by FIFA no matter who wins or how many bad calls take place. All for the good of the game, ofcourse :)
How ironic, an Octopus in a German aquarium which was born in the UK, accurately predicted Germany’s win over England.
Can’t see the Brits selling anymore sea food to Germany (lol).
Unfortunately, the refereeing after the 1st round began to deteriorate to the extent where I keep wondering if the Mafia is running the show rather than FIFA. Then again, FIFA under Blatter closely resembles the mob in terms of autocracy.
well, Italy is out, and Russia wasn’t in, so I don’t think the Mafia is involved!
;)
Maybe they are involved as someone probably stood to make a lot of money if the team went out :) Even though Italy was not expected to win, they weren’t expected to finish bottom of their group.
England had a blatantly obvious goal that wasn’t awarded, while Argentina had a blatantly offsides goal which was awarded. Everything happens so fast in the modern game that you can see why the refs/linesmen can’t get it all right. It’s only blatantly obvious on… VIDEO REPLAY.
But FIFA will most likely set up a committee to meet after the world cup & do nothing as usual. And 4 years from now they will come up with a new ball that will automatically bounce back if it touches the goal line or hits the underside of the crossbar. They will do anything to avoid video replays
Chicago.
Goal line technology exists. The ref doesn’t need to get it right, the BALL can get it right itself… and a camera on the goal line has been in use for YEARS successfully in the NHL… takes 10 seconds to confirm.
Offside… is a judgement call. Its like pass interference in some respect.
There are some close plays you can look at the video over and over and not be 100%.
What’s your point? I know it exists, but who cares if they won’t implement it.
Simply stating:
There is a difference between them implementing video review for “offsides” and a “goal”.
one is a lot easier to implement.
Arthur, how is the mood in England?
Is everyone blaming the referee and/or Sepp Blatter or do they think the team is simply not good enough?
There are so many different opinions that I am hearing.
I think most people are saying the squad are simply not good enough.
Vela dropped to the bench for today’s game.
Might still be getting over the injury from the second group game. Right after it happened, I read he was already doubtful for the round of 16.
That disallowed goal was just awful but this is a bad call that can somehow appease both Germany and England. Germans can tell themselves that call makes the pain of 1966 go away. Whereas, English fans can blame the ref for their loss and continue to believe the myth of the greatness of golden generation of Lampard, Gerrard, Terry and Rooney and ignore the fact that their English heroes were poor at this world cup or previous tournaments for that matter. No one in England will point fingers at the failure of their players but at the manager and ref.
That’s is so true Sachin. They’ll blame the foreign manager, the foreign referee and the foreign players in the premier league.
There are plenty of Brits here in my city & it has been interesting to hear their views. Sure there was plenty of swearing at the incident but after the game, most people at the pub did not say the ref cost England the game but they mostly wondered how the second half would have looked like at 2-2. I didn’t hear anyone say that if it was 2-2, then England would have surely won the game, I think the manner which they went down 2-0 and the way the second half went was a bit sobering.
Amusingly, plenty of English fans stuck around for the Argentina-Mexico game and kept shouting “Come on England” throughout the Argentina game. The Argentine and Mexican supporters had to try keep the English supporters quiet but they couldn’t as the few English supporters were in full song belting out songs.
The Brits I know… are RIGHTLY pissed off about the call, but they agree that England played like SHIT all tournament, doesn’t have a top keeper, and under-acheived with this group again.
No, they might have lost 4-2… but at least they would have had an even shot in the 2nd half.
They didn’t because FIFA is fecked up.
Stag, totally agree. That call RUINED the game! Otherwise, I see it staying 2-2 and going to extra time, maybe PK’s, or 3-2 to the Germans, who would’ve actually had to work for the goal. England had to push so far up the pitch to open the 2nd half, sine they were still down.
The OUTRAGEOUS thing is that that f*cking piece of shit Blatter holds a meeting every single year to discuss the possibility of goalline technology and he shoots it down every year. His stated reason is that it wouldn’t be the same at all levels of the game. But who cares. They have light-up backboards and video-review of last-second shots in NBA and college basketball, but they don’t have it lower down at the HS level, and guess what? No one cares!
That’s a moot point, however, as I believe his stated reason my just be cover for his real, more cynical reason. Blatter is a greedy, corrupt, moronic asshole who only cares about football in so much as it makes money. These controversial decisions are good b/c they create lots of public and media frenzy, which equals more attention/exposure, which equals even more money. Controversy is publicity, and there’s no such thing as bad publicity. Goalline tech would cost money to implement and would potentially reduce FIFA’s revenues, and that’s why he’s against it. Someone should shoot that man… for the Good of the Game.
putting a chip in a ball … is technology that EXISTS.
It would cost them NOTHING.
as far as Arsenal are concerned…
the media seem to think Schwarzer is coming to Arsenal, for
a bargain basement 3.5 Million.
That’s perfect for Arsenal, isn’t it.
meanwhile, with Mourinho in … he is reportedly shopping for
a new keeper, meaning Casillas might be OUT, and he is being tracked
by ManU and ManCity.
That’d be perfect, we get Schwarzer, they get Casillas!
I can see us getting Schwarzer, Joe Cole FREE, Chamakh FREE,
resigning SOL… and some other no name defender for a few million.
Cesc goes out for 40 Million, and we make 35 Million in profit.
WHAT A SUMMER!
;)
a month of madness coming up with the end of the WC and the run
in to the start of the EPL.
DAG?
New Thread?
PLEASE!!!!!
Stag,
Cesc is going nowhere this summer at least, so count out the 40 mill.
Give DAG a little time, he is probably still hung over ;-)
Arthur.
what makes you think Cesc will stay, and as I have asked before,
WHY WOULD YOU WANT HIM TO STAY?
If Cesc wants to leave Arsenal, says he does, why would you want him in the team?
You are going to force a player to stay?
Why would he give 100% and risk injury, that happens almost every year to Arsenal AND Cesc?
Why would he play if he has a knock, and risk his future for a team that is FORCING him to stay someplace that he doesn’t want to be?
He isn’t bigger than the team, has done his time here, and wants to go home to Barcelona.
You let that player go, and get a good ransom from the sale.
I don’t want Cesc at Arsenal, if he doesn’t want to play for us.
Forget about all goal-line technology crap, I’m in favor of droid ref. Here’s my first choice:
http://www.movie-collectible.com/images/SS2212.jpg
He speaks 7 million languages or so I hear.
It had to happen at the World Cup.
Hopefully no FIFA smarten the feck up.
If Lampard’s GOAL counts… then it is a completely
different game altogether.
They don’t have to come forward and try and score in the
2nd half, they can play a different style or way.
I am not saying they would have won the match,
but they might have… at 2-2, England would have all
the momentum in their favor.
The whole world saw it was a goal.
All FIFA had to do was OK goal line technology that already
exists, or use the chip in the ball, that already exists.
Instead, you RUIN a match between two footballing Titans.
Congrats FIFA.
How bad were England really? Or were the Germans that good? Like I was saying to HTS it appears Ghana have a better DF unit than England though they are playing with a 19 yr old CB! Amazing!
England looked so good defensively up until this stage I fair Ghana may suffer a similar fate at the hands of Diego and co, but in the mean time….
Sing Sing Africa :-D
I think I said something about Germany being overrated :-D
Can Arsenal buy the whole Germany squad? They’re young after all ;)
I would be statisfied with Oizil and Muller.
Fantastic game! If England pick up where they left off in an attacking sense they will win but dynamics change at half time so there is no guarantee of that.
This game will go down as a classic!
4-1 :-o
It’s over!!
Arsenal style counter attack from the Germans ;)
Better than I’ve seen from Arsenal for years. We are not that clinical.
Oh no what a bad call
-1 What a Game the Lions back in it
Oh my days England 2-0 Down – it’s over!! LOL! Wait ’til they get home
Lampard’s goal was good though.
Yeah it was :-(
I guess, ref has to give peno to the German in the second-half, but rules out the goal to even thing out :D
Germany go route 1 and Klose makes Terry, Upson and James look like they’ve never seen such a tactic…
1-nil to the Germans….
GDC anyone?
2 Nil now…James nutmegged by Poldolski at an extreme angle. English defense carved open….Could be a fun match now, esp if you’re not an England fan….(Love the edit feature)
I am going to a friend’s place to watch the Germany vs England game.
My friend is German and there will also be a Dutch who will be supporting England.
Should be fun. Hoping for a good game.
My German friend was supposed to come over. Alas, early kick-off on Sunday isn’t working well.
Good Morning America, I hope now that you are over your hangovers I hope you will join me in backing Ghana for the rest of this world cup ;-)
I’d like to see them do well. Making it this far makes you wonder how much better they could be with Essien.
I mentioned before the tournament that the US would miss Charlie Davies. He and Jozy displayed a real chemistry in the Confederations Cup and Bradley giving that kid a chance last summer changed the whole dynamic of the US team. Davies gave the US a striker with very descent pace who could actually finish. The other strikers either are not good enough or are not ready yet. Dempsey is not a striker but that’s what Bradley was left with. If Gomez could have come on later in the game to play alongside Altidore, it could have been interesting.
Anyway, well done to the US.
How about well done to Ghana? Josh Sour Grapes :-P
No sour grapes. I simply have little interest in Ghana. As for the US, they did about as well as expected.
To be honest I would have thought the US had enough to overcome a weakened Ghana side. But hey it’s great for the host continent. THe USA played well throughout and are far more competitive than 2006. Things are going to get a whole lot better for US football, you are alll but guaranteed qualification in the CONCAF.
Every WC we should see a improved US side.
Well, I think the US had a good tournament, and
nothing to be ashamed of…
their never say die attitude could only overcome
so many deficits…
We are getting better… and can “compete” with just
about any team, on a given day, but we still lack that
“game-changer”. There is no star player that the team
revolves around, no Cesc-type in midfield, or Ronaldo-type on the wing, or a super-striker… we lack that aspect, and always have.
Altidore COULD become that player, as at aged 20, I have to believe
he will improve, and develop.
A good run, some impressive games and fightbacks throughout the run,
but alas, we didn’t have enough.
The SUPPORT was ABSOLUTELY AMAZING.
EVERY PUB was FULL from Noon … 2 1/2 hours before the match
even started… lines down the street of people hoping to get
into soccer bars, Irish bars, and ANY bar showing the match.
I have not seen that before here in the US…
Yeah USA had nothing to be ashamed off. They had a good tournament.
Hopefully next WC they will not have to face Ghana in the KOs yet again.
Bradley the coach called it right. The pace of Findley and Altidore was almost Ghana’ undoing. If they were better finishers then it may have turned out different. I did not see what Gomez offered when he came on, he was fresh too but had no impact.
Uruguay have clinical finishers and with the inexperience in Ghana’s DF they are likely to suffer at the hands of Forlan and Saurez. However I am hoping Forlan has a bad day in Africa will have it’s first ever semi-finalists.
Stuck in Detroit on my way out to Seattle with only a blackberry to use (laptop being kaput) so not much chance of coming on YAMA much.
I watched the game at an Irish pub at the airport and the place was not only packed full, there was a massive crowd of travellers watching thru the glass wall. There was the whole gamut of ohs and ahs, and even some rather informed commentary. I was amazed really.
I hope it continues really.
No ones posting… post-match depression I guess. Like we didn’t have enough of that around here already…
Also, I hope there’s no one out there calling for Bob Bradley’s head. He did a good job devising a system that play’s to the strengths of a team that has a high workrate and can be physical, but lacks technique. And he won the group for the first time since 1930.
Well done Ghana. What’s with the US conceding early. I watched the game at a local bar, and right after extra time started, I said to the ppl at my table, “now just don’t concede in the first 5 minutes of extra time too.” And sure enough…
Honestly, what’s with the early concessions? Lack of concentration? Do they need more time than other teams to ‘get into it’ for some reason? Or are they one of those teams that simply can’t, won’t, perform at their best unless their up against it? Ghana’s second goal was magnificent, but the first one was the result of a stupid loss of possession by the US, followed by the defense’s failure to close down, and then a GK who despite being very good, left far too much space at the near post. To do better in 2014, they have to:
a) Hit the ground running. Come ready to play, and don’t dig a hole early!!
b) More consistent finishing… all around. We create enough chances. (On a related thought, I always preferred Gomez to Findley. Real Salt Lake player starting over the top scorer in the Mexican league? I’m sure Bradley had his reasons, and Findley is not the only one who failed to finish off chances… but still.)
I thought that Ghana would score early in extra time too. I also thought that the US would find an equalizer and it would go to penalities with the US pulling it out. But with Altidore going off for the extra time period, the US was always unlikely to score.
On Ghana’s first goal, that was all Clark and Tim Howard. The defender gave Boateng the near post and the keeper should have read that and taken up a better position. Howard was in no-man’s land.
SING SING AFRICA!
Stag EAT humble PIE!
I am.
No problem saying WELL PLAYED to GHANA.
I hope they beat Urugauy…
It was a good match, a tale of two half’s…
So graceful in defeat Stag that’s so un-American :-P
Well done Ghana.
SING SING AFRICA
DRINK DRINK AMERICA
No Crushing, squashing or body bags here!
Come on Ghana finish the job :-D
Well contrary to the “C-R-U-S-H-I-N-G” which some were predicting, Ghana have shown they are more than a match for the Imperialists ;-) .
But alas this a is a game of two halfs so plenty time for the US to get back into it. Despite having a 19 CB I think has a better DF than Slovenia so the US will have be at their best to break them down. But for the meantime….
Sing, Sing Africa! :-D
You’re calling us the Imperialists? Don’t throw stones if you live in a glass house… at least the sun sets on ours.
Oh, and need I remind you which empire it was that both the US and Ghana gained their independence from?
(I’m not being bitter about the loss- Ghana fully deserved the win, and my goal all along for the US was to get out of the group stage- I just think you’re suffering from a little historical memory loss here.)
Don’t mind arthur, he is has a knack for making emotional judgement on topics he isn’t well informed about ;-).
:-D that’s my forte you know Fred!
You are bitter ‘Cago, filled with sour grapes no disguising it :-P
And who told you you got independance anyway! That’s a fallacy. The Rothchilds own you, your Federal Reserve and your illegal president ;-)
Not really bitter. I usually only get upset when my team plays poorly, or is robbed by the refs. USA actually played BETTER than I thought they would.
Good Win for Ghana and Africa.
You have to tip your cap to them… they played well enough to win today.
Feel very sad for Korea.
They were clearly the better team, but were undone by a lack of clinical finishing and a fantastic finish by Suarez.
Arsenal fans will be very familiar with that.
Uruguay delivered a sucker punch early on but otherwise it has been Korea on top.
I hope they equalize, they deserve it.
Missed the first half, but the Koreans are controlling the ball in second half.
Well done S. Korea. Went down with a fight.
The knockout stage starts and no one in GDC!
People are probably heading to pubs for USA -Ghana game.
I guess the arm chair fans will be in GDC for that game. ;)
That’s what I am. Sitting on the comfortable chair at home :)
Enough about France. Am really looking forward to Germany-England.
Spain-Portugal aint half bad either.
My France starting team for WC 2010 (in my great, infallible wisdom ;-)) would have been:
GK: Lloris
RB: Sagna
CB: Mexes, Sakho
LB: Berthod
DM: Toulalan, Pedretti
AM: Gourcuff
Wings: Ribery, Briand
ST: Benzema
Not a very high profile team. Folks would even have passed to Gourcuff.
Benzema would have been an absolute beast.
@ Arthur:
— Living and working in Europe and mentioning it on a blog aint an ego trip. Turns out high schools in Holland and colleges in Germany are free! Turns out most kids who grow up in the Netherlands can speak 3 languages too. So me being able to speak four languages and living and working in Germany and France and criss-crossing the continent isnt anything special at all. The only folks amazed by that are my fellow yanks and Brits. So that knocks out your “ego” argument.
— I still dont understand why you continue to argue with this statement:
“France should have purged their team after WC 2006”. They scored once and finished bottom in Euro 2008 and scored once and finished bottom at this World cup. They also played woefully in both qualifiers and would not have even qualified if Henry had not blatantly cheated.
Again, why are you arguing with that? LOL!
— As someone who has actually been in France on/off for a cumulative of over three years and have worked with tons of French folks of various ethnicities, I have infinitely more information and knowledge about French support than you with your one day trip to Calais. You cant even read any of the papers or blogs in the native language and you are arguing with me. LOL.
— Lastly: France should have flushed the team clean the way Germany did in the last few years – they promoted a lot of their U-21. And the way France did after the disappointment of USA 94 non-qualification – then they also promoted a lot of their U-21. The current France youth setup has actually been quite strong. Blood in the young kids with a few experienced ones and they would have gotten their feet wet at Euro 2008 and had a good crack at this World cup. They surely couldnt have done any worse than the current old, disaster players.
Players that could have/should have been blooded in my “humble” opinion:
Defenders:
1) Mahmadou Sakho
2) Jackie Faty
3) Jeremy Berthod
4) Greg Bourillon
Mids:
1) Tony LeTallec
2) Moussa Sissokho
3) Julien Faubert
Attackers:
1) Jimmy Bergougnoux
2) Youan Gouffran
3) Jimmy Briand
In defense:
Mix these guys oldies but goodies like Mexes and Gallas. Why Mexes is not a solid starter in the NT I would never know. Probably has the wrong sign ;-) Retire Abidal and the clique-loving Evra and blood in Clichy (even though I personally am not his biggest fan).
In midfield:
Make the team revolve around Gourcuff naturally. Blood in those guys with Toulalan, an oldie like Pedretti and definitely Vieira. Vieira is a born winner … far more so than Henry, Anelka, Ribery and the others who went for the ride. He might not have the legs, but even then Diaby still cant see him in his dreams.
In attack:
Benzema, not only should have been in the world cup team he should have been the MAIN striker. Club form has nothing to do with national team. Mix it up with Gignac, and the other new boys.
Having guys like Anelka, Govou, Henry, Malouda, Diaby, and Cisse play for your team in 2010 is just incredible really.
All in all this team would have been closer knit (especially as they came through together) and hungrier and far less stupid than the WC squad. They surely would have done better than the cumulative of 2 points and 2 goals that France has acquired in 2008 and 2010. This is the EXACT same step they took in 1994 … when the flushed the team and retired Ginola, Cantona and co. and brought in the new boys headed by a young, Bordeaux playmaker – Zidane.
LOL! HA! I ain’t even going to waste my time replying much less reading all of it!
I’ll do what I normally do ;-)
Oh I know u read it! You probably thought of a borderline logical response and couldn’t come up with any response to my foolproof argument and have no words to defend you comically hysteric remarks ;-)
Game. Set. Match!
LOL!
Happy that Chile made it through. The red card was unbelievable.
Hearing a few rumors linking Ryan Babel to Arsenal. When Babel was first linked to Arsenal, I was strongly opposed because of how much Ajax wanted for him and I declared that he was no where near van Persie’s class; for whom we paid less than three million pounds for. We all know the end of that story.
What I’m thinking now is that Babel game has taken a step back since leaving Ajax. However, he’s still got talent and will certainly improve under Arsene Wenger. His story is strikingly similar to Thierry Henry’s. TH14 was about the same age as Babel is now when he signed for Arsenal. Henry was in a team where his talent was marginalized. I also think Babel has a strong desire to be successful.
The big question is will Liverpool let him go. They just sold Benayoun and are about to sign Hodgson as their new manager so it may not happen. But if Hodgson is willing to sell him and Wenger declared an interest, I’m thinking Arsenal would be his preferred choice. Six million would be a fair price for him. Four million would be a steal. Babel can still become a superstar. Another question is what would his signing mean for Theo and Jack? We need a proper winger and Babel is certainly that. The competition would be good for all parties; including Eboue. Maybe it’s too much right now, but if he became available, it would be hard to pass on him. We’ll see.
Josh, I think Hodgson has more interest for the England NT Manager – not manager @ Pool.
South American teams topped 4 of the 7 groups with Chile also in control of their own destiny. That continent came to play!
so did NORTH America!
:)
Yes, the U.S. and Mexico did represent. Here’s to booking our place in the Quarterfinals! 1-0 to the U.S. Dempsey with the goal (preferrably early in the first half).
Wishful thinking Mr Gunner.
1-0 to Ghana my friend :-)
Arthur.
did I say CRUSH?
or was it SQUASH?
;)
enjoy the match.
I hope you’re drinking a lot of booze in the pub you’re in mate.
Ghana doing the squashing right now it seems ;-)
I really hope Spain and Chile make it through. Both very exciting teams. I give credit for Chile to play an attacking style, it’s always harder for a medium/small country to play like that than a big country like Spain. Switzerland are boring to me. Unfortunately, the way Nip phrased it above, Chile could be in trouble. Come on Honduras, score one!!! I’ve had a soft spot for them sine last June when I saw a US World Cup qualifier against them at Soldier Field. The stadium was probably 50/50 b/w US and Honduras fans, and all their fans were super nice and created an awesome atmosphere. 50/50 crowds always create fun atmospheres.
well… the Swiss play very good defensively… with them needing a win, they might have to go forward a bit more!
I promise to have a new story out tomorrow or tonight. I’ve had 4 straight 12 & 13 hour days at the office and have basically been going hme, going to sleep and doing it all over again.
Will try and churn something out as soon as I get home tonight (whenever that is)
no sweat DAG.
We don’t necessarily need a big story/write up…
just: USA v GHANA, and the Wenger Chronicles – GO!
This N.Korea Vs Ivory Coast match is looking really “weird”. Already 2-0 to Ivory Coast with only 20 mins gone. Wont be surprised to see a landslide win for Ivory Coast at the final whistle.
Looking forward to today’s matches, although I might have to watch the later ones on tape. Portugal and Brazil both need to figure that Spain will beat Chile and will be coming into the eliminations with strong momentum, and thus both will want to go through as group winners. With Kaka out (and Julio Baptista starting in place of Robinho) Portugal could easily have a chance at winning the match (and the group) esp. if they can get an early goal. And, of course, the later games should all be good. I’ll sit in the GDC and see if there’s anybody to join me…
Some wild happenings in the earlier third round matches and some promising pairings for the eliminations (if you’re tired of the same old teams pushing through to the semis/finals). Obviously the US late victory was the highlight, but the Asian teams’ performances were also strong and the Slovakia and New Zealand matches had me switching back and forth with a lot of excitement.
And plenty of GKs on display who might improve our team, although maybe my favored keeper (Sorensen) didn’t have his best outing yesterday….
well, GK’s can’t have great matches every time… its more about consistency.
and our keepers, consistently were poor.
If Spain beat Chile by one goal and the Swiss beat Honduras by two goals, Chile are out.
I think the Chile will end up regretting not beating Honduras and the Swiss by larger margins, despite dominating both.
Chile. going thru.
no regrets.
:)
I believe I said they’d be a surprise in the tournament.
Large share of surprises (so far) in this WC.
The teams that have caught my attention are: Japan, Chile, the chemistry of Argentina, and at times Slovakia.
I can see Chile giving Spain a real run for their money today.
As much as I’m rooting for USA to beat Ghana, they will need to find away to be more clinical
in their finishing.
Despite their lackluster effort in group play, England has a solid chance to take Germany. The CB’s for Germany can be exploited by the power & speed of Rooney and Defoe.
I agree, the USA need to step up their game tomorrow.
Have to take it up a level.
and.
totally agree that England can beat Germany. Nothing to fear for England, they can beat anyone on a given day. (besides the US! LOL)
Kiwi, it’s clear that you are not a fan of van Persie. However, you can’t deny that he is a very special player. I do believe it’s essential that he have cover and Adebayor did a very fine job covering for van Persie a few years ago. This year, Wenger has brought in Chamakh to cover van Persie. However, van is the man.
Back to New Zealand, I really like that Woods kid too. Didn’t know he was only 18. He’s got to draw comparisions with our very own Bendtner. However, I think he’s got a bit more gusto about him than Bendtner; he doesn’t appear afraid to put himself about. Will be watching West Brom with interest this season.
I’ve already gone on about Paston. Thirty-three is a good age for a goal-keeper. Look at the US’s very own Friedel and Howard. Despite their obvious talent, they weren’t quite ready until they got closer to thirty. It’s then where they both showed dramatic improvement. Even Arsenal’s Lehmann wasn’t quite ready when he was at Milan but he was about the business by the time he signed for Arsenal. Paston’s best days are yet to come.
Delighted with Japan’s win over Denmark.
Have nothing against Denmark, but very happy that Asian teams (Korea and Japan) are doing well.
I continue to be mystified with regard to Arsene’s valuation of players.
10M for an unknown 24 year old CB.
3.5M for a 37 year old GK.
Not willing to pay 12-15M for established players between 26-28.
Hmm…
Nip.
Vermaelen was an UNKNOWN.
I would much prefer he sign a unknown 24 yr old at CB, than sign NOBODY, and/or… a 17 yr old for 2 Million.
Schwarzer is being mentioned, and he is an upgrade on Almunia/Fabianski…so it might be a short-term fix until one of our 4 keepers emerges!
and NOBODY has been signed YET. Its all speculation, and I wouldn’t be surprised at all if it was a smokescreen, we sign other players not mentioned, or we sign nobody.
If Cesc goes, then it doesn’t really matter anyway, that is the MASSIVE chip that must fall (or not) first…
we were mentioned with Montolivo of Fiorentina too, and I think he’s very good.
Until they hold up the shirt, its all silly season speculation.
SSS.
Yeah guys I watched the All Whites. A valiant effort from an improving well coached team. There has been a lot to like about the way they’ve conducted themselves in this tournament and I know the whole country is proud of what they have done.
Some of the young guys in this team are very capable and if they get the breaks they could carve out good careers at strong clubs. All good for NZ football – defenders Reid and Smith both young, very athletic and excellent, Woods(18) the young striker is also very promising and at WBA in the premier league.
Any yet it seems a shame to be undefeated and yet go out, alas, football at this level is like chess, you have to ‘play the game’ and have the killer moves. In this game the All Whites lacked the ability to get that killer goal. That was partly due to the girls-blouse-playacting of Italy which then got repeated by Paraguay players. Every time Rory Fallon competed for a high ball the Paraguay players clutched their faces. I know a level of gamesmanship is present in all top sport – yet this widespread cynical stuff is just pathetic. Effectively they made Fallon redundant, the lad was scared to get a yellow card.
Italy going out is kinda nice. I have never admired their national team nor their domestic league. AC Milan with Ruud Gullit, van Basten, Rikjaard, Maldini and Baresi was a thing to behold – yet Serie A is fundamentally boring imo.
While I don’t admire the National team… as the diving / acting is over the top by Italy…
(and one reason to like the US, because for the most part, they don’t pull that shit)…
there are exciting offensive minded teams in Serie A… they don’t play like the National team.
Thank god, neither does the EPL/England!
Malign Van Persie if you will but the goal he scored is why I love him. Sees Kuyt is offsides pass to von Bommel gets the give and go and on his bad foot nutmegs the keeper.
Had he been fit for the run we would’ve been better off for it.
So there.
_______________________
If’s but’s and maybe’s…. yet history doesn’t lie. You can like him all you want, that doesn’t improve his durability. If he’s not on the pitch he won’t be contributing the ooooh’s and aaaah’s. And until he actually turns in an average season of appearances there is no rational argument.
Sooner or later Arsenal fans will wake up to the fact that continually relying on fragile ‘star’ players is a hurdle too high for the remainder of the team. Sorry, sometimes the truth isn’t that palatable.
1. Didn’t see the Dutch goal. Japan had two awesome FK’s though. The first was from extremely far out, and the second was full of trickery- very “cheeky” as they say across the pond. Hands up if you had Japan in the last 16…
2. I think just about all the regular posters on here have mentioned how they’ve been swayed by one keeper or another in SA. Guess it’s not to hard to be impressed by keepers if you’re a Gooner.
3. Someone emailed me this very funny call of Donovan’s goal yesterday (http://www.fanaticos.com/2010/06/23/asi-narro-andres-cantor-el-gol-de-landon-donovan/?sms_ss=twitter), but it still can’t top Jack van Gelder’s call on Dutch radio at France ’98 when Bergkamp scored in the 89th minute to knock Argentina out at the quarters. It is the single bests sports call ever: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=exlBHTyB1R0&feature=related.
“2. I think just about all the regular posters on here have mentioned how they’ve been swayed by one keeper or another in SA. Guess it’s not to hard to be impressed by keepers if you’re a Gooner.”
Quite a few GK have been singled out so far. The funny thing is, I can’t remember anyone, on here or elsewhere, saying that they’ve been overly impressed by Mark Schwarzer. Yet he’s the one we’re going to get?
The commentator calls are great.
Actually I am a big fan of Scwarzer – he is a big reason Fulham did so well this season. Some of his play in the Europa Cup was amazing.
Also he has done quite well in the Australia matches I did see.
I have not been impressed with him this tournament. Looked uncertain at times, and got caught in awkward positions on several occassions. To be fair, Australia’s defence left him in the Germany game and he seems to do well with mid-table Fulham, but I just don’t see him helping anyone capture the league title. His acquisition would be a total half-measure.
Oh yeah, and he’s old. Are we paying a transfer fee and then offering him a one-year deal? What would be the point of that?
I think the experience of playing in Europe last year for Fulham will only help him. A bit bigger stage, and he played very well.
Also, he’s familiar with the Premier League and teams, so there is no learning curve there.
Not my first choice, but I am not choosing… Arsene Wenger is… and he is BETTER THAN WHAT WE HAVE. Definitely.
I previously mentioned this world cup felt like 2002 due to the struggles of some of the European teams but now with USA & South Korea advancing and Japan 45 min away from round of 16, 2002 has more shades.
Will be curious to see if any European team can finally win a world cup away from Europe as they have failed to on 8 previous tries. Although Europe has won 9/10 tournaments held in Europe, the exception being Brazil ofcourse, who have won the tournament on 4 continents. Brazil would probably like to add a 5th continent as well and in 4 years time they will get a chance to rectify a failure to win on home soil.
Things are definately a lot more interesting and I am glad I got back into the swing of the tournament after the first few days when I feared a watered down tournament.
Malign Van Persie if you will but the goal he scored is why I love him. Sees Kuyt is offsides pass to von Bommel gets the give and go and on his bad foot nutmegs the keeper.
Had he been fit for the run we would’ve been better off for it.
So there.
Some news on the Gallas front – Juventus have turned down his contract demands (wants £94,000 a week). All the other interested parties in him also want nothing to do with those demands.
Well maybe we can get him on the cheap if we want. He has lots of ‘baggage’ but if we could get him for a discount I’d be for it. Not likely though.
RVP is a class striker, when fit.
no doubt about it.
Gallas.
not surprised he wants crazy money. that’s why we told him to move on.
not getting 2 years, and not getting a raise. sorry.
why would anyone want one of the French players from “that team”…
they might pout and not practice!
I hope Gallas rots, and has to eat crow, and beg Wenger to take him on…
1 year deal, same salary.
1 year deal, same salary.
———————————
Agree. Hard to believe he was our captain.
That’s quite remarkable indeed. Who would have thought NZ finished above Italy in the group?! In fact, unbeaten as well despite going out.
You have to feel for New Zealand. In both of their 1-1 draws, the goal they conceded was very dubious. Actually, Slovakia’s goal against them wasn’t even dubious: it was blatantly offsides. The Italy PK was more of a judgment call, but it was a bit soft, IMO. If either one of those goals had not happened, NZ would have 5 pts instead of 3, and… well, you get the picture.
I watched the New Zealand game because I wanted to see Caceras and that New Zealand goalkeeper again. I know a lot of you were on the Nigerian keeper but that kid from New Zealand, Paston, is the real deal. He really impressed me the other day and I had to see him again. The kid is tall, quick, decisive, commanding, dynamite shot-stopper, and looks very relaxed in goal, considering it’s the World Cup. He’s kept New Zealand in every game. Too bad they couldn’t score. He certainly looked better than Italy’s keeper.
I just googled Marc Paston and he’s 6’5″, 33 years old, and plays for a team called Wellington Phoenix in New Zealand. He’s just signed a one year contract extension. With only one year remaining on his contract, Wenger can offer what they may consider good money and bring him on a trial to see if he’s any good. We’ll see.
do you really believe he is on Wenger’s radar?
its not logical.
The only thing about him that fits Wenger’s profile is that he’s relatively unknown. But he’s over 30, so that rules him out. He’s also a GK. Wenger doesn’t like GK’s nor CB’s, nor non-Brazilian DM’s.
I agree it’s unlikely, but Wenger did bring in Lehman in his 30’s.
I’ve also been impressed with the Swiss keeper Benaglio.
That’s because almost EVERY keeper looks good, when you compare them to what we’ve witnessed this season from Almunia and Fabianski.
I’ve been waiting 4 years to day this… F*CK ITALY!!!!!
It feels so good to finally say it. I’ve been so tired of every time I go to a public place, seeing some asshole who knows nothing about football wearing a blue shirt that says “Italia” and has four stars on it. Sure, the same thing will happen w/ whoever wins this time, but at least it won’t be me least favorite international team. I know I’m probably overreacting and being a bit irrational, but sports are emotional, not rational. Now if only I could get rid of all those idiots who know nothing about football and wear Manchester United shirts shirts everywhere…..
why do you assume Italian-Americans know nothing about football?
perhaps they just support the Italian National team AND they do know football.
Not sure about Chicago, but Boston has a LARGE Italian population… and a good number, watch Serie A, and the International game.
The same can be said of some ManU supporters.
I see a fair number of Arsenal shirts, are they idiots too?
Not sure where you are coming from, other than being excited about Italy being knocked out.
I never said that all the people wearing the shirts were Italian-Americans did I? You have a really bad habit of putting words into other people’s mouths and then refuting the ‘arguments’ that they never made to begin with.
Just because someone’s wearing an Italy shirt doesn’t mean they are of Italian heritage. Is everyone who wears an Arsenal shirt from Islington? Is everyone who wears a City or United shirt a Mancunian?
These people are not real Italy fans. If they were, how come I didn’t see so many Italy shirts before that? And why will I see all those Italy shirts replaced by another team’s shirts after July 11? Because people like to get in on the winning bandwagon.
It’s the same in every sport. You should see how many Blackhawks “fans” suddenly popped up out of nowhere around here over the past 2 years, and especially that past 3 months. Similarly, how come I see a shitload of Drew Brees jerseys now, but before that it was Peyton Manning, and before that Tom Brady? Bandwagon fans: they show up for every winning team in every sport. The only reason this one bothered me so much is b/c I really don’t like Italy.
Well, Chicago might be different, because I don’t see random people wearing ITALY shirts!
and honestly, I don’t see many ManU shirts on random people as well… they are usually fans! there are a lot of Brits and Irish in Boston.
I see, you don’t like Italy.
I’ll assume the team, because the country is a beautiful place, and so are its people!
La Famiglia is watching you!
;)
Nothing against the people or the country.
I find I have to be very careful of that as a US Soccer fan. Once or twice I’ve exclaimed my dislike for Mexico, and it took me awhile to realize why everyone was reacting so negatively. You have to say “the Mexican soccer team.”
LOL.
I am of Italian decent, and frankly, I don’t like the style the Italian team play, or the way they dive and flop and exaggerate every foul.
I don’t mind them going out at all… but there will be a lot of long faces in Boston’s North End tonite.
Italy are chasing the game.
WC winning coach makes three changes – full back, defensive midfielder and a striker.
Hmm ….
NZ went out without losing any game.
France OUT
Italy OUT
Who’s Next?
Ghana’s next.
:)
:-D
What a game!
Ended 3-2.
Humdinger.
This WC is brilliant.
I agree.
It’s been great.
But I remember early on that people said it was boring, no scoring…
The first round of games were boring, but then on, it has been fantastic.
as I stated at the time, to be expected… as nobody wants to lose or make the mistake in the first game.
When I said it was boring, it was boring. After the second round of group games started, though, it’s been awesome.
What drama in this WC.
Italy are now down 0-2 and if NZ win their game, they will go through.
Kiwi, are you watching?
Italy are a goal down !
For the third time in as many games.
Bet lof of football experts in the English press are enjoying their humble pies today.
Like I said before, it’s not a good idea to rubbishing England like they were already out of the World Cup when the group stage hadn’t even finished. That is like rubbishing a team who’s trailing a goal by half time like they have already lost the match. Comments like that often backfire. The beauty of football.
I’ll take my hat off for US as well. Quite frankly I thought US were having those “one of those days” after seeing them missing so many chances in the match. Credit to their players for never give up. They deserve the win.
As for Germany Vs England, I bet the first thing most people had on their mind when first learned about this fixture is – penalty shootout.
I think I predicted a shootout win for England before the tournament started. If the tie really goes down to shootout, I still have a strong feeling England will nick this one.
If Italy and Spain are not able to get themselves out of the 2nd place, we will have Holland vs Italy and Brazil vs Spain in the 2nd round with the winners facing each other. Only one of those 4 can reach the S/F.
I think Spain will be very keen to get out. Italy are less likely as it is out of their hands.
From that squad you could cull Eduardo, Rosicky, Walcott, Vela and Traore with almost no impact to the squad. That would free up a lot of squad real estate to bring in a serious striker (to challenge RvP) and a serious CB to partner Vermaelen. The French Pole should be 3rd choice, Djourou 4th.
Reinforcements in CM are a lost cause. It won’t happen when Wenger can rabbit off 5 names plus Nasri.
Schwarzer is the best we can hope for.
If all that happened we could at least have a crack.
As always, the strike force looks awesome, provided everyone can stay fit.
__________________________
Nip are you serious? ;-) The strike force is perhaps the weakest part of the squad. RvP will not be fit – we know that. It’s just a matter of how many games we can actually get out of him – can he crack 15? So…. we’re left with Chamakh who has never played in the EPL and never exactly set the French league alight, Bendtner is average at best but probably better described as ‘solid’ but limited, and Eduardo is a sad case. So what is awesome? Walcott???? LOL
I think the same problems will persist as last year and the year before and the one before that. This squad lends itself to an ill-defined shape. It favours 4-3-3 because that formation allows players to hide and masks the fact that we haven’t got the partnerships and individual robustness to play 4-4-2 in the EPL. The 4-4-2 formation brings transparency and accountability so Wenger will shun that.
Our game is offensively geared and yet we don’t have the lethal strike capacity that we need to win the title. It’s that simple.
If a miracle happened and Robin van Persie stayed fit like a normal player then the whole outlook could brighten, yet that’s such a remote possibility. Gambling our season on RvP is negligent, yet Wenger gets away with it every year.
I assume Arsene will continue with the 4-3-3, so by strike force I mean all in the front three – Arsh, Sicky, Cole, Nasri, RvP, etc.
It is awesome on paper. ;)
On a pedantic note, I said “looks” awesome, and not “is” awesome.
LOL
As for being serious, after the Wigan debacle, I have decided to try and not take Arsenal too seriously.
IF the transfer rumors are true, this is how our squad shapes up
Schwarzer, Almunia, Fabianski
Vermaelen, Koscielny, Djourou, Campbell?
Sagna, Eboue, Clichy, Gibbs, Traore
Cesc, Diaby, Song, Denilson, Ramsey
Arshavin, Joe Cole, Rosicky, Nasri, Walcott, Vela, Wilshere
van Persie, Chamakh, Bendtner, Eduardo
As always, the strike force looks awesome, provided everyone can stay fit.
The CM looks thread bare (have I missed anyone?). Ramsey is returning from long term injury, Diaby is highly inconsistent and Deni is just Deni. Nasri can play CM but does so only when Cesc is missing and hasn’t proven very successful in the league so far (although CL he seems to do just fine).
CB looks fine on paper but Koscielny is an unknown and nobody knows what is Djo’s fitness levels and if Sol will stay.
Theoretically, we need one more CM and CB. That is in addition to Schwarzer and Joe Cole.
Fingers crossed.
so you have Schwarzer, Koscielny, and Joe Cole coming in based on
TRANSFER RUMORS.
Yet, you still have our best player CESC, in our team… despite transfer rumors, fact, and reality!
LOL
Fact is, he wants to go, reality is, he likely will.
Without Cesc, Arsenal would have to bring in a bit more than a CB, a keeper, and Joe Cole.
Well, based on rumor, Arsenal have upped their bids for Schwarzer and Koscielny. Man u has said they aren’t bidding for Cole so he is running out of places to sign if he wants CL games. And Arsenal have told Barca to fuck off, so according to speculation his team looks about right.
yes, take the red tinted glasses off for a few minutes.
speculation looks right to you…
I would say Cesc going is equally likely to any of the 3 you mentioned signing for Arsenal.
It has nothing to do with glasses, rose tinted or otherwise. He said IF rumors are true. Could Cesc go? Yes of course, but Arsenal holds the upper hand and in the I don’t think Barca will pay the asking price. If Cesc is sold they are going to squeeze every last penny out of them.
As for the rest of them, I based what I said off known reports. Nothing to do with optimism/pessimism just what has been reported, just like you are basing what you think about Cesc on what has been reported.
One of Uruguay, South Korea, USA and Ghana will make it to the S/F.
What a great opportunity for them! Let us see who takes it.
England missed a golden chance. By finishing second, it now faces Germany and then Argentina/Mexico. Only one of that four will make it to the S/F.
Oh, I think we know the USA is going to the Semi’s…
;)
I agree that Howard is ready to be nearer the top of the food chain. He’s really seen his stock rise with this world cup. He was a bit green and not quite ready for that pressure when he was at Manchester United. We saw the same thing happen to Brad Friedel when he was at Liverpool. But the boy’s a bit older and is certainly ready now.
Arthur, what’s your connection to Ghana?
We are going to SQUASH Ghana!
;)
and Germany v England is going to penalties!
LOL
very much enjoying the World Cup.
Once it ends, dread… as usual, Arsene has done fuck all
early on in the Summer.
C’mon man, I thought you were all about winning the Profit League! Arsene is shedding players and bringing in younger, cheaper ones (if any). Looks to me like he is doing lots to maintain our position atop the profit league table for yet another exciting season!! ;)
Yes. That’s fantastic for the Arsenal Football Club Inc.
We will ALWAYS win the Profit League, and it will be easy this year with Cesc’s sale!!
However, the PLAN ONLY WORKS, if we remain TOP 4.
Without that, the PLAN fails.
So…
You have to bring in players to improve… just sell off, and shed more than you buy.
Will be easy with the 40 Million GBP we get for our Captain.
;)
Stag, this is where your Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde version comes out.
On the one hand, you claim to support Lord Wenger in all he does.
On the other hand, you dread that he has done fuck all.
Just decide which one you want to be.
It will be easy for all of us and yourself too. :)
Nip.
At the end of the day… the end of the season, every season…
WENGER has guided the Arsenal to EXACTLY where he is expected to be.
Top 4.
You simply can’t deny it… that’s the AFC’s goal, and he acheives every time.
I embrace the PLAN, with Wenger running it… make the money, reduce the debt, finish Top 4.
Now, I truly believe Cesc is GONE. Its a matter of money…
so, in order for the club to maintain the Top 4 spot… we will have to ACT … and as a few on here had said, it would be better, smarter, easier… to do it QUICK. Pre-WC… or during-WC, so there is not “panic buying” at the end of the Summer.
So, while I can WISH HOPE and DREAM that Arsene and the Arsneal bring in some players… as long as he continues spinning his magic and keeping us Top 4, then he is Lord Wenger, ruler of Highbury County.
I’m not so sure that Cesc is gone this summer. Next summer? Probably. Laporta is gone at the end of the month and he is the one desperately trying to cement his legacy and get Cesc. The incoming president has already said that Barcelona are already in too much debt to splash for him. That could be double-talk, but that isn’t usually how Barca works.
OK. I hope you are correct…
but WHY WOULD WE WANT CESC HERE, if he WANTS TO BE AT BARCELONA?
do we want players in the team not commited to the cause?
he wants to leave. that means he isn’t going to be happy at the club, as we REFUSED to sell him, even after he gave 7 years of blood sweat and tears to the club.
If he gets a knock, why should he play injured?
if he gets injured, why would he rush back?
As soon as a player wants out, he wants to LEAVE YOUR CLUB, why would you want to force that player to stay?
We could have forced Vieira, Henry… etc…
but their heads were turned, we sold them.
It would also piss off the rest of the players in some respect, knowing that Arsenal do not care about the wishes of its players. And in Cesc’s case, he has given Arsenal his all… played injured, given us his best.
You repay that type of service by granting the player his wishes if he wants to go.
Of course… we need to be handsomely compensated.
40 Million.
I don’t specifically remember reading anywhere a direct quote from Cesc saying “let me go.” The only words I’ve seen attributed directly to him were that he had a very eye-opening talk with Arsene.
I love Ghana I have been there on several occasions, love the place and the people.
You will not crush Stag my dear friend, hopefully for you another slippery fingered GK may have to come to you aid once again.
I remember the last world cup an American I used to work with was saying something similar before playing Ghana. I told him they are much beter than he thinks and lo and behold after the game he was making excuses about how it wasn’t a penalty ;-)
we will CRUSH Ghana.
C-R-U-S-H.
;)
yeeeeeeeeeeeeeah.
Get ’em a body bag! yeah!
Ha Ha! Come On USA lets have it!!
Ghana 1 – 0 USA
Remember where you heard it first :-)
it might be 1-0 Ghana.
we like to spot teams a goal early, it adds to the excitement for our supporters…
but in the end,
like a grape…
@ josh:
Some of us where stuck at work. And today we had to be on the road at a symposium. Funny thing tho was that everyone was regularly checking their phones and I kid u not there was a light roar for the goal! I was shocked and impressed. The game is slowly but surely catching on.
@ DAG:
Is it possible to work a blackberry or iphone app? I know that might be a bit much tho.
If I could find a programmer that does APPs I would certainly do it.
I will see if I can find someone.
Hmmm… YAMA iPhone app. That’s interesting summer project …
An app for what now?
No worries, Fred. I mentioned that I knew most of you guys were at work and sometimes you simply can’t get away.
Awesome to hear of you, and stag, experiencing the same reaction to US soccer by so many neutrals. The roars I heard blew me away.
LOL! Oh sorry Fred you were referring to this comment you made (I just read it)
“I said France should have purged the team after 2006 and for some reason you disagree with that.
You have NEVER been to France and know nothing about the country and dont speak the language and you happily admit it YET you actually argue with me. LOL!
Get the oestrogen levels down boy. Its not like I insulted Adebayor or anything? ooops!:-) ”
Like I said before when you say some really ignorant things I usually ignore and I should do so again but sometimes I cannot resist the temptation ;-) .
Predictably you do what you always do change the focus of discussion as I said in the comment above.
But I will answer one thing I have been to France (Calais), once. It is not a place I have ever envisioned going to again, I learnt French in secondary school, although I was good at it, I was never interested to learn it in any depth. You can speak French in every local dialect possible it is of no significance to our disscussion and even if you could speak Swahili fluently it doesn’t impress me.
I have been all over Europe on business the only places I will visit again for pleasure is Holland and Turkey. I need not come on here to tell people what I do, or what I have or how many languages I can speak my ego doesn’t need to be fed in that way.
“I said France should have purged the team after 2006 and for some reason you disagree with that”
LOL, no really, LOL. I said to you apart from Nasri and Benzema who better than the current squad do they have? simple question. Your ego leads you to bring up a fictious list of 10 players more worthy than the current squad members. You then go into some senseless drivel “informing” me that only North Africans and Caribbeans support the French national team. I highlight the blind stupidity of you generalised assumption and you answer none of the points that I make but rather say “and for some reason you disagree with that”
You have no idea how funny that sounds to me! I have given you plenty discourse as to why I don’t agree (basically they ain’t got any better players), you answer none of the points I raise but rather claim you don’t know the reason I disagree.
I would love to write a script with someone like you as a central character I could create so much laughter.
long novel. will respond at the weekend when i can actually use a pc.
no stress though … its just fun ;-)
Yeah, just fun! I’m am waiting for you to get to a PC and defend the indefensible ;-)
Nice disciplined and tactical performance from Ghana, they were on par with the Germans throughout and I think were the better side in the first half. But hey, one mistake, a big one at that and bam! you lose the game.
I was happy with the result but would have rather the Us not have made it through as they are far tougher opposition than Slovenia. But I was happy with the result as it meant Ghana won’t play England.
It will be a interesting game Ghana – US. Ghana now how to stop a team from scoring but cannot score themselves, especially when Gyan plays like he did today like man who is leg weary.
Ghana beat USA in the last world cup butI think this USA side is far superior to that one, I would even go as far as to say they are an excting team to watch as thay are capable of some clinical atrtacking football which inevitably brings goals.
This game will be hard to call, I think the USA will have the edge as their attacking potential is superior to Ghana but if Ghana find their shooting boots anything can happen.
I am looking forward to some cheeky but friendly banter with the US fans on game day chat. Remember don’t take me too seriously it’s just fun.
Come On Ghana!!
As for England – Germany it is now I expect those three lions to roar. Another “anything can happen” type of game, depending on which England shows up. I was saying after the Australia game that the Germans are not that good as people were hyping them up to be. They barely beat Ghana in a must win game, I don’t think the Germans can get any better than what we have already seen but England can get better, but will they?
I expect they will, and defensively they do look reallly solid despite Ferdinand and Ledly out. If they can muster the attacking threat to match the DF heroics than guarenteed they will beat Germany.
You were right Art, playing against those 10 men in game 1 flattered the Germans. Perhaps they are missing Ballack as much as everyone thought they would originally (i.e. before the first game, after which everyone said they didn’t need him). Also let’s not forget they have 4 other injured players who probably would’ve made the 23-man squad.
I’m not sure who I will be cheering for in that game, but if you want those 3 Lions to roar, they better do it like they did in ’66, cause Germany has made the quarters in every single world cup going back to 1954… holy shit.
They were banned in 1950, and so every single World Cup in the post-war era that they’ve been allowed to participate in, they’ve made the last 8. If the Lions can break that streak then this might really be their year.
Chicago,
Just like the Spuds being unable to beat us in the league, the run had to end sometime.
The lions can break that streak but I doubt this will be their year though
Oh come on Fred leave it out:
“@ Arthur, check out my response to your emotional blabbing in the last thread. Keep the hormonal response to a minimum … just logical points please :-)” What are you on Fred!
Like I said in my response. I was having fun highlighting your apparent short sightedness. I was not in the least bit emotional, your ignorance is too funny to get emotional about :-D honestly! If I came across as emotional, sorry it was not intended.
I answered each of your points logically Fred, but you answered none of
my points logically, or at all. As usual you ignore legitimate and valid points and rather change the focus of the discussion. This is a consistent pattern that I see with you in much of your arguement. My theory is that your overtly large ego exorts you to cover any perceived embarrassment.
Fred if you make a legitmate claim, if it is valid and someone questions it and you viewpoint is obviously in error it should be seen as a learning experience. No big deal we are all wrong sometimes. But with you it is always about winning or losing an arguement. It doesn’t have to be like all the time. Chill out.
you actually just went into blabber mode and didnt really respond … its in plain view man.
The ESPN analysts are saying the USA is the underdog for the game against Ghana. I think both teams are dead-even. Ghana will have more support, being the only African team left, but unlike last time we met, there is no Essien. Also, they only 2 goals they’ve scored so far in the tournament were PK’s. Not a single goal from open play, nor even one from a set piece!
Plus there is something about this US team. A drive and determination. They kind of remind me of Fulham this past year… Dempsey is lucky to be a part of both stories.
or, both teams are lucky to have Dempsey in their team!
;)
True. He was a fighter today, playing bloody until the end.
What drama in Group D !
Finally, it is Germany and Ghana.
That was very exciting to watch. Both groups today were full of highs and lows, an awesome day for football.
The GK who has impressed me the most in the WC so far is Handanovic, the Slovenian keeper. Heard that he was quite good in Italy as well where he plays for Udinese.
1st clean sheet in ages for USA. Back 4 (at times) looked unorganized and thank goodness Algeria did not have finishing
skill upfront.
CG is right about ESPN’s huge investment into broadcast rights; that said, the USA has evolved into a melting pot of cultures……more so than ever before.
I remember watching ABC broadcast the WC final (I believe in ’82) and had the audacity to break live play for commercials.
Donovan, Bradley, and Howard are the only USA players whose talents fit with Arsenal. Altidore has been impressive in last 2 matches, showed me more recently than in EPL.
Altidore would be a great fit for the team. Don’t forget he is only 20. Good hold up striker with strength and pace, he just needs to improve his finishing. Howard would also be a great fit but Everton would hold out for mucho buckaroos.
Bradley would be competing with Song for the DM role and Donovan gives us nothing we don’t have already.
All true.
http://www.arsenal.com/news/world-cup-2010/world-cup-2010-news/wenger-france-lacked-unity-and-quality?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+arsenal-news+%28News+Feed%29
Arsene says of France – “But even more than that there is not enough quality in the team.”
I hope he realizes that 4 of the starting 11 were Arsenal players.
Arsene hypocritical? Never.
France has plenty of quality. They lacked guidance, leadership, and continuity.
I can’t remember ever screaming so loud at a television. After so many chances finally a wave of relief. Congrats to the USMNT!
I would love it if the Gunners signed Howard, even if it costs us a good size chunk of dough. It would be worth the money as he could be the foundation for our team for at least the next five years. I also don’t think it would be unreasonable for him to request a transfer for a chance to play regular CL football. Everton can only hang on to him for so long. Better to get paid.
I just got back from a friend’s place.
Congrats to the USA for not only winning the game but also topping the group.
I am sure you guys will be rooting for Germany next. :)
I don’t give a crap who we play!
We can beat anyone from that group, including Germany.
I was way too busy screaming my head off at my 55″ TV to join you guys on the site (lol).
Wanted England to crash and burn because of their over-paid, overrated, over hyped, morally bankrupt, self centered, bottling, sex crazed players.
Although I want the US to do well, Brazil was, is and always will be my team at the national level. I have followed them from the 60’s and they have brought me decades of “Jugo Bonito”.
And yes, Germany versus England would be more than fitting.
“over-paid, overrated, over hyped, morally bankrupt, self centered, bottling, sex crazed players.”
LOL!
Oh I so want England to beat the Germans. Come England!And Ghana
If Capello had stayed with the same side as the first two games, I think England would have taken a bow. It was plain to see that something had to change but who has the guts to bench your stars?
In fairness, it was an easy call. If those overpaid assholes couldn’t win the first two games against the US and Algeria, who got in by the skin of their teeth, what logic says they will win a third game?
How many chances did Dempsey miss?
Do you know how popular this tournament is making soccer in the US? I was in a cafeteria during the game and there were people who were finished eating that stayed to watch the end of the game. When Donovan scored, there was a ridiculous roar as everyone seemed to be watching the game intently. To hear 300+ American people who could give two shits about soccer give such an incredible cheer about a soccer game was an awesome experience. It was so loud in there.
I think the sport is somewhat like swimming, gymnastics, track & field, and other olympic sports- lots and lots of attention every 4 years, but not as much in between.
I think European football will continue to get much more popular, particularly the EPL and CL, but I only see MLS getting as big as the NHL at the most… the domestic US sports market is SATURATED beyond belief.
Just the American interest in soccer is likely to improve on the strength of the American’s gutsy performances today.
ESPN must be RELIEVED. They spent I think $400 million on the broadcast rights for the 2010 WC, and you could really tell from their marketing they were banking on a US run to the 2nd round or quarters.
Josh, every game I’ve watched so far they say “And we’d like to welcome those of you joining us on AFN, the American Forces Network.” Is that how you watch the games over there?
That is right.
After we went through the trouble to win the group, we better not get stuck w/ ze Germans in the next round. Please let them win the group and stick the England w/ the ‘old enemy’.
Germany v England it is in the cards. England can pull out all the old heritage stuff again.
Funny story on the Mail –
Tierry Henry has called French President Nikolas Sarkozcy to discuss the melt-down. So I guess when Henry calls french president’s listen.
Second and more interesting to US Arsenal fans – an American journalist who I can not name – covering the world cup – ran into and had a discussion with Arsene Wenger. Based on Arsene’s response it looks like there is interest in bringing someone from the current USMNT to Arsenal.
While I don’t necessarily believe every interent rumour – the source of this information is a very well respected US journalist.
If that is the case there are only 4 or 5 players I could think of:
Landycakes
Howard (doubt Everton will let him go though)
Altidore
Bradley Jr.
Dempsey (longshot)
The journalist wasn’t Peter King was it? Because that guy is pure idiot. I find it hard to believe that Arsene was that open with anyone in regard to transfers, so we’ll see.
All of those are interesting players. I’ve always liked Dempsey and he’s EPL proven. I’ve never really liked Donovan – thought he was too soft – but he showed alot at Everton. Altidore could be a monster and Bradley is just a damn smart player.
Not King. this is a footie writer.
I could see him being open with a journo if it was ‘off the record’. Professional journalists take that very seriously, b/c if they didn’t, no one would ever give them anything and they’d be out of work. When they say a conversation is off the record, they really do mean it.
Bradley would be an excellent box-to-box guy w/ lots of fight and leadership. Donovan is good, but we’ve got enough of that. Ditto for Dempsey, plus I can’t see him leaving the Cotttage. Howard would be AWESOME, but I agree- why would the Toffees let him go? Altidore would be a good backup at CF. At least it would prevent Bendy’s complacency when RVP gets hurt.
Altidore is 20.
He would be excellent as a back-up CF.
Totally agree.
But Wenger would never do it.
Hopefully Kroenke will force him to, when he takes over!
I have British friends that go to Austria every year for Arsenal’s training. They have told me they believe it will be the last year this Summer… that it will likely be in the USA in the future!
I LOVE IT!!!!!!!
I was just talking about how good I thought Bradley was when I was posting during the game. He’s the only one I could see as a Wenger-type signing. He’s young, not a big name, and is likey to not be too expensive.
Dear USMNT,
For the sake of my sanity and blood pressure, would it be possible for you to score earlier in games? I already get enough of this watching Arsenal play. Thanks in advance.
Seattle gooner
Agreed its bad I have to deal with this crap every August through May – could I please have the summer to recuperate?
Not according to the USMNT.
By the way great win but too many easy chances missed – Altidore’s was a pure screamer
Ummm.
BLAME THE REFS!
They scored ANOTHER goal, perfectly ONSIDE, and got screwed again.
But it just added to the drama.
Absolutely magnificent…
World Cup Fever has gripped Boston!
I blame the refs for part of it, but there were lots of other chances to score well before the 90th+ minute. That was a pretty crap call though.
yes, I agree that they had chances, but… THEY SCORED on one of them, and the ref called it wrong… again.
Same situation.
We convert, finally, and its called off.
luckily, we kept fighting.
Chicago, welcome my heterosexual brother. The rest of those guys are gay. U-S-A is right, bitches!
Oh bite me. The rest of us are still picking ourselves off the floor.
GO USA!!!!!!
Welcome, DAG.
;-)
I can’t believe none of you un-patriotic assholes are on the site celebrating with me. The US winning the group is a big deal, you presumptuous homos. It’s the first time in 80 years.
Really, I’m in Afghanistan so I just got off work while most of you guys just got to work. However, today would have been a good day to, momentarily, go AWOL from the office.
Sorry, would have been here earlier, but I still can’t believe they pulled it off. Thought there would be more people in here talking about the games. But then again, a large contingent of the people that come here aren’t even American so I guess they might not really care as much. But anyway: USA! USA! USA!
90 minutes of nail biting frustration!
1 moment of ecstasy!
What can anyone say – great result for USA.
Josh.
Went AWOL from work.
Apparently so did half the city.
Every bar packed to capacity… the ROAR when the US scored was like an explosion… people singing and partying in the streets of Cambridge, MA…
U-S-A!!!!!!
After getting no PK for a German handball on the goalline in 2002….
After a mysterious, unexplained PK given to Ghana in 2006…
After a perfect game-winning goal disallowed against Slovenia…
After another perfect goal disallowed in the first half today…
…we finally get a little luck, and are going through!!!
Ah, who are we Americans to complain about ‘luck’ and ‘fairness’? The rest of the world was probably glad that for once it was us getting the shaft instead of giving it.
The two best teams advanced from group C. Algeria were what Wenger calls anti-football today. England made the changes that they clearly needed to make. I said that Milner, Defoe, and Cole needed to play. Guess who scored for England and guess who provided the service? If Capello can keep his head out of Rooney’s ass, England may do well.
US win the group unbeaten. Will we play Germany or Ghana? One team put the US out of the last World Cup and the other team put the US out the World Cup before that. Let’s hope the boys can get some payback. Maybe Serbia will advance. We’ll see.
I see Germany and Serbia both going through on 6 pts, with Germany topping the group due to their 4 goals against Australia.
NOBODY WANTS TO PLAY THE USA!
YEAAAHHHHHH!!!!
Watching the US today feels like watching Arsenal.
Damarcus looks hella old. He needs to give it all up and go with a bald head.
I think it’s mad that Dempsey, a midfielder, is playing as a striker when you’ve got strikers on the bench. Stoopid. A striker would have buried those missed chances.
I really like the look of Michael Bradley. He’s a legit good player. We need a goal. C’mon, USA.
I really don’t like that Bornstein kid playing LB for USA. Hope he proves me wrong but he’s not a good defensive player. If I were Algeria, I’d attack him non-stop because he’s bound to screw something up.
Tell u the truth stag, I’m more gutted that Vieira didn’t get pick for France than Theo for England, Cos it was Paddy’s last chance playing in WC, while Theo is young enough to have another go. And Paddy even went to Man Shitty just so he could get to play in WC.
If anything, at least they got a player there who really WANTED to play for his country. As u said, they would have got a “leader” there. A positive leader. Unlike Evra, his first act as the captain was to get his teammates boycotting the training. I don’t know whether France FA were right or wrong for shipping Anelka home. Bottom line is – the France players are PLAYERS. They should not be involved in any game of politic. That’s not their job.
I’m also very sad to see Thierry Henry ended his final World Cup in such a manner.
Vieira could have won a Champions League if he’d stayed at Inter Milan.
Likewise, only an assclown would lead his team to boycot a training session during a World Cup. How can any captain spearhead such petulant behavior? I’m far from a Domenech fan but he was right in calling the player’s actions unbelievably stupid. I thought it was just Nasri but the entire French team are a bunch of selfish pricks.
Uruguay has been under the radar but they’ve been very good. They’ve got a few strikers who don’t need a lot of chances to score. However, the highlight is their team defense. They haven’t conceded a single goal so far. I see them sneaking into the semi’s.
Nice ball from Sagna to release Ribery for the France goal. Need more of that from him next season.
Harsh sending off given against Gourcuff. After that, Diaby, again, found himself with no one to play with.
Clichy was less than stellar for South Africa’s second goal.
Ribery gave a good effort tonight; the kind he always gave when I became a fan of his at Marseille. Just too much dribbling into bad situations. Had a bit of Jose Reyes in his game tonight.
Squilacci should have been an Arsenal player five years ago. He certainly should have been preferred ahead of a LB who’s never played CB.
Lloris is a very good keeper.
As it turned out, Nasri and Vieira probably are feeling lucky now they didn’t go to the WC. The performance and behavior of the French squad probably will go down to the Hall of Shame of France national team’s history.
Funny thing is John Terry tried to do the same with England by trying to get his teammates doing a “France”, luckily other players saw sense and no one back him up.
I agree with you on Nasri and Vieira, but something tells me Paddy would have been a leader, and a revolt with someone like Vieira or Zidane there, would never happen.
It lets you know that their older players are not good leaders… Evra? Gallas? even Henry…
can you imagine an Arsenal or United team in revolt against Wenger or Ferguson?
It would absolutely never occur.
One of the BIGGEST MATCH DAYS in recent HISTORY for the
USA tomorrow…
Looking forward to a good effort, and hopefully the players
stepping up and playing well EARLY… establishing themselves,
instead of going behind to a quick goal.
JOZY ALTIDORE for the winner!
and… I hope England CRASH out.
Slovenia can definitely give them a run.
All this drama with the French National team makes for great speculative commentary.
I’m sure Evra will come out with his biography, “What it means to be National Team Captain”
Yes manager, the players, and FFF are all to blame. However, it is not Arsenal players at the source
of the controversy.
I wonder if England will use the Slovenia match to usurp the spotlight from the French? Will
Evra be outdone by Terry?
By the way, for those of you who did not really watch the France match or maybe you need glasses:
1) Sagna played very well defensively and offensively! no one has mentioned his fine through ball to Ribery that resulted in their goal. Plus many excellent crosses.
2) yes Clichy was over powered defensively for the 2nd goal; but he still exhibited more positive play in
90 minutes than Evra did in 180 minutes. Down a man, in front of their countrymen, you would have
expected SA to play with more energy, determination, and passion and place great pressure on the France back 4.
3) Diaby – he was out muscled for the header. Yet by most interpretations of the laws, fouls are consistently awarded when a player climbs the back of his opponent to their advantage!
AND we MUST not overlook one of the best pieces of magic at the WC so far;
that it was Diaby, on the touch line / with his back to the field of play; receives a pass from Sagna and quickly plays a sweet back heel pass that “nut-megged” his opponent, catching Sagna in stride, who then played the through ball to Ribery for their goal.
Sad to see France eliminated, as I wanted all of our players gain valuable experience from the WC. Selfishly, it will only help Arsenal to have Song, Clichy, Sagna, and Diaby return earlier than expected.
The French goal was not exactly magic, or the best piece of anything in the World Cup, in my opine…
Ribery passed to Malouda, who scored… goal and assist, neither player from Arsenal.
Nice build up, but not exactly spectacular.
I agree that Sagna played pretty well, and that the French defense had it pretty tough a man down for most of the match.
Oh, that was Gorcuff, by the way, with the elbow to the head…
He didn’t exactly play well in the WC, and thats coming off a dissapointing season for Bordeaux.
His sale price either just came down a lot, or nobody will take him.
22 Million?
feck that shit.
I would say that Gorcuff’s sending off was a bit harsh. He may have led with his elbow, but he didn’t throw the elbow, big difference when players are clashing for a header in the PA. In EPL – that foul would never be called a foul.
Sorry, but Gorcuffs play in the 3rd match, b4 the red card, was excellent.
The actual shot into goal, no – there was nothing magical; nor the Ribery lay off; but Arsenal players made the goal opportunity.
he led with an elbow to the FACE of an opponent.
you are responsible for your actions on the pitch!
OK. tell me how he was “excellent”.
South Africa led 1-0 in the match, France hadn’t created much… and he was sent off in the 25th MINUTE?
What did he have 5 touches of the ball in 25 minutes?
makes no sense, sorry.
Sagna and Clichy would be fine if the team overall was strong and competitive. Sagna is a defender firstly and a good one, Clichy is an athelete with a great engine yet subject to a touch of calamity. Yet they are both good players and would look just fine in a competent side (and let’s not forget they’re fullbacks). Like much of the team over the last 5 years, the players individually get put under the microscope due to the weakness of the team corporatively. So players who would otherwise be fine in the context of a competent team attract (overly) strong criticism.
This is why winning is so critical. Winning makes the importance of many many weaknesses that are always present in any team diminish, indeed they vanish. It’s magic – winning is a panecea for almost all sporting ills.
On the WC, this opening group stage suggests the margins between the great and the rest is closing with each tournament. I always go on about how football is a game determined by only a few events, and this seems to be coming even more true at international level. Amazing how many superpowers are either imploding or raked with worry. Amazing, unbelievable even. Teams staked with supposedly rare players paid kings ransoms are being reduced to thoroughly unadmirable squabbling spoilt rabbles.
We’re seeing a new (but not new) penchant to turn on the coach – yes it’s now all his fault. Evra & Terry should be able to pick the team and playing formation. Keh? It’s so ridiculous and yet the players will justify themselves – yuk. I disliked Evra before, he personifies the arrogance of French culture, this just confirms it. With Terry, the man finds new ways to sully his reputation and character. He’s dim, a man without honour or wisdom. At least England have a serious manager in Capello.
Capello says he’s keeping Terry in the team. I’m sure he’s trying to downplay the event, but to quote the Italian himself: “it’s a very big mistake.”
Kiwi, you’re getting into circular logic. Do players’ faults get magnified by losing, or do those faults actually cause the losing? I say it starts with the latter, and then the former turns it into a downward spiral.
Organization, tactics, discipline, preparation, etc. are improving in the middle- and lower-ranking national teams, which is what is responsible for the closing of the gap. There are 2 reasons I think it isn’t happening at club level too (or might even be going in the opposite direction):
1. Club teams play together year-round, so it’s harder for one club to out-organize, out-strategize, or out-prepare another club than for an NT to do the same thing.
2. NT’s from rich countries can’t simply outspend NT’s from smaller countries the way big clubs can do to smaller clubs. Sure, a wealthy and populous nation has a definite advantage over a smaller or poorer opponent, but it is indirect; it is an advantage that can’t be directly transferred into better players, as can be done with a wealthy and popular club.
Kiwi, agree very much with you on Clichy and Sagna.
They would be excellent, if maybe the wingers tracked back once in while to help defensively.
When we made the great run to the CL Final, it was because EVERYONE was tracking back with a vengeance… and thats how you post numerous shutouts, and have solid defense.
(oh, and you have a goalkeeper who has a clue)
France is the most bipolar team ever. At the last 4 World Cups they have either made it to the final or finished last in their group, with 1 point both times.
The difference between the up years and the down? Zizou. Injured in 2002 and only played one game, and retired this time.
Argentina should have no problem with Mexico… just like 4 years ago.
Uruguay versus South Korea should be a decent contest, but I gotta take Forlan and Co.
Diaby, Clichy, Sagna, Gallas(formerly). What a drab uninspiring quartet of players.
Agreed. I will not miss Gallas at all, Clichy and Diaby are not good enough, and Sagna seems to be sinking to their level.
Clichy and Sagna are VERY good.
I hope they are our starting Full Backs for YEARS.
Speed, talent, skills, play hard, play hurt…
I actually don’t think Clichy was very good last year in the EPL. He got caught out of position frequently and was muscled off the ball often. Not good traits for a defender.
He does have pace and likes to get into the attack. However, last season I don’t remember him creating much or being much of a threat when he did.
you are aware that he came back early from injury because we were down to our?? 4th left back?
he played injured for much of the time after he returned.
that usually affects a players game, and not positively.
I could see why you would be frustrated w/ Gallas’s shenanigans over the years, and Diaby’s immaturity, and Clichy’s inconsistency- but what do you have against Sagna?
PS: Kanu- still got it.
Clichy played HURT… came back early from injury because we needed him, and all he got from this lot, was abuse.
misguided.
Sagna will never be as bad as the other players, but he’s still very limited, and defensive mistakes have been creeping into his game.
he was the most consistent Arsenal player in the team… after Vermaelen.
He was flat out SOLID.
I think Sagna is good. In fact, his first season he was one of the bright spots in the team defending exceptionally well and making intellengent/dangerous runs forward. However, last season he didn’t have quite the same presence. I’m just hoping that he gets back to the higher standard.
Tshabalala
is a good player…
even though they are out, South Africa played
pretty well in this tournament.
Our dear and lovely Diaby is having a great game against South Africa.
On the first goal, he makes a half hearted jump and lets Khumalo score.
On the second, he can’t clear a ball and off the rebound, South Africa end up scoring.
Nice!
That’s our man!
FRANCE is in complete MELTDOWN.
Karma is a serious BITCH.
And she is kicking France’s ass…
they are an embarrassing shambles.
I am sorry to see Diaby, Sagna and Clichy on the pitch… I don’t want any of the negative residue to get on them.
If anyone on the French team was used to meltdowns before going thru this one, it would be those 3, as they have dealt with it for 3 seasons in a row now.
And Clichy got outmuscled for the second goal as well. Add this to ex-Arsenal player Senderos injuring himself tackling his own team mate and it’s like playing for Arsenal is some kind of world cup curse. Cesc better watch out.
Cesc?
barely playing.
he’s not a starter for the Spain team. Maybe next WC.
Doesn’t mean he can’t be cursed. Or that he won’t contribute to Spain. You don’t have to be a starter to contribute, as Cesc adeptly proved at Euro 2008 (and against Villa).
I think Cesc WILL contribute to the team… if he plays.
But I don’t mind him not starting at all. He’s not clearly better than the players who start ahead of him…
and he’s coming off injury anyway.
It’s a joke – I don’t believe in curses or Domenech’s astronomy.
The French manager, and the players… were the worst bad joke of the tournament.
Le Mess.
and I loved seeing them go down in flames.
I usually support France, but with Vieira not getting a spot, and Henry older and not a factor, I don’t see much to like in the team other than Clichy and Sagna.
I agree – the only reason to pay attention to them was because of allthe Arsenal players. I’ve been amazed that Domenech has held onto his job this long. Maybe now the FFF will wake up and can him. And the factionalism in the team is amazing. Not talking to players and not passing to them in games?! How that can be allowed to happen I have no idea.
Arsene’s valuation of players remains a big mystery.
10M for Koscielny? Verma cost the same but had much more credentials. If Koscielny proves to be a flop like Sendy or Cygan, we won’t get more than 1-2 M for him. At least Sendy and Cygan were not bought for huge fees.
The other thing is that Arsene seems ready to pay a premium on a player like Koscielny, while he didn’t seem ready to pay 12-15M on Barry or Alonso a few seasons back.
I just cannot understand it!
Yeah, I still cant understand why pay 10 M for such an unaccomplished player.
He is 24 but has only played ONE Ligue 1 season for a lowly club. Has absolutely NO international or UEFA cup experience.
How does someone like him cost 10 million???!
And why is miserly Wenger willing to cough up that amount for him??
In comparison, Simon Kjaer is just 21, taller, good defensive header, strong, fast AND has been a starter in the Serie A for a solid club like Palermo …. but he has a buy out clause of 8m. Subotic is similar and can be got for even less than that 8m.
So both are younger, more experienced and CHEAPER!
I don’t mind paying 10 Million for a player that Wenger wants.
If he likes the player, 10 Million is a fair risk.
We didn’t know Vermaelen …
And we haven’t signed anyone yet, so the “reports” could change…
until the dude holds up the shirt, it isn’t completed… and it appears we are haggling over price.
Kiwi,
I believe Wenger’s wisdom is – to defend from the front; attack from the deep.
On attack, he wants his forwards to press and closing down the opposition defenders. Do not let them to get organized, and force them to rush their kick up field, so that we can trap them with our offside trap.
At the defensive end, he wants ball players rather than specialist (such as an old fashion stopper). So that we could launch our attack from the back. With all 4 of our back 4 have the ability to carry the ball up field.
At least that’s the idea. Execution is another story. Take defending from the front, we do need our attacking players have the discipline to keep pressing the opponents. Early in the season, such as the Everton win, our attackers had worked hard enough to execute the game plan to good effect. Unfortunately they didn’t keep up the effort as the season progressed.
Back to the CB issue, I was surprised to see Valmaelen’s ability to carry the ball out of defence. For a big lad, he got a great footwork. Unfortunately CBs like him are extremely rare. A combination of power and skills.
As for keeping Sol, I’m all for it.
My idea CB combination in a squad is –
Two starting CBs at their peak, aged around 24-32. One powerful, dominated in the air. One pacy.
Two back ups. One experienced, over the hill, yet still got the know how to fill in when he’s needed.
And one up and coming CB.
So a combination of – Vermalen + a new signing + Sol + Djourou should be enough.
As for Gallas, I will agree with Stag for this one. I like him as a player. But first he’s injury prone. Secondly, he loves to bitch too much. Won’t be sad to see the back of him.
So a combination of – Vermalen + a new signing + Sol + Djourou should be enough.
_____________________
Andez, if we knew Djourou would be fit that squad might be sufficient. But we simply don’t know Djourou’s state of durability. Under your scenario if/when one of the 2 first-choice players fall injured your reliant on Djourou and that seems dodgy.
I agree with you on the make-up of the CB combo in size/ability. Sadly Wenger doesn’t support such conventional wisdom.
How do you know ANYONE will be fit?
Do you think Gallas will be? He’s been injured every season as well.
Sol and Djourou are perfect back-ups in my opinion. You can rely on them for 15 games each, in all competitions. One’s winding his career down, the other is trying to re-launch from injury.
Right now.
We don’t have anyone besides Vermaelen and Djourou.
@armchair, vibe.
Well, if you guys are Americans. Then it’s your country, not mine. If you guys are happy that US get “robbed” by that wrongly ruled out winning goal. Then it’s fine for me as well.
It’s foolish on my part, why would I wanna speak out and defending your country on your behalf? My mistake.
Happy playing neutral then. U guys been doing well so far. Keep up the effort.
I’m w/ you Andes. We was robbed! Sure, they could’ve played better in the first half. But it shouldn’t have mattered, had the ref made the right call.
If… IF Spain beat Chile and if… IF Switzerland beat Honduras, someone with 6 pts will be going home at the group stage.
I wonder if the reverse has ever happened: going to the round of 16 on 2 pts. I did the math, and 6 pts is the most you can have and still not make it through, while 2 pts is the least you can have and still make the cut. (Both require GD as a tie-breaker.)
Why is Wenger willing to give really long deals to really young players, and also really short deals to really old players (at the back), but not “normal” length contracts to “normal” age players?
Is it b/c he sees both as a bargain, whereas the third option isn’t?
For those wondering if there are other CB considerations being looked at – in addition to Laurent Koscielny, Arsenal are reported to have made inquiries on:
Everton’s Phil Jagielka
Dinamo Kiev’s Pape Diakhte
Gallas looks set to sign for Juve once he is booted from the World Cup with the rest of the French reprobates. Senderos as we know is at Fulham. Sol is contemplating between Celtic and Arsenal. Which leaves Djourou and Vermaelen as our definites.
A word about Sol – first given who is on the current England squad – he definitely should’ve made it. Much more fit than any option they currently have and frankly a lot better than what they have.
I don’t see a negative in signing Sol for a 1-year contract.
He is a leader.
He has experience.
He isn’t going to want or be capable of playing many games. (as noted 15 would be nice, in all competitions)
There is no real risk in having him in the team.
If he goes to Celtic, I understand the move for him, 2 is better than 1… but if he stays, its a positive.
Gallas is long gone. Juventus can have him. He’s perfect for them… aging, injury every year… The old BITCH who players on his own team don’t like… playing for the Old Lady of Italian Football.
Una bella cosa!
I’m easy with Sol staying – he’d be ok in tandem with Djourou. It’s foolhardy to think Djourou will be good for a full season after such a serious injury and given he’s never played a full season before. So….ideally we’d have:
1. Vermaelen
2. perhaps the French Pole
3. another good contender
4. Djourou/Campbell
Last year we had Gallas, Vermaelen, Silvestre & Campbell and it wasn’t enough. We shouldn’t repeat that mistake. Although…. we seem to repeat mistakes don’t we. ;-)
Off Topic but an interesting point:
Arsene continually speaks of CONTINUITY as being the key for his teams, re-signs most of the player’s, even the marginal ones we would love to see go, and yet, we only have 2 CB’s under contract at the moment.
For all this talk of continuity, we constantly see key players leave year after year, after year. Hleib, Flamini, Gilberto and Diarra a few years back, Ade last year and potentially Gallas, Campbell and Silvestre this season.
Isn’t ‘continuity’ less about specific players, and more about keeping third/fourth place?
continuity |ˌkäntnˈ(y)oōətē|
noun ( pl. -ties)
1 the unbroken and consistent existence or operation of something over a period of time
Yep. That’s it.
I really hope Spain doesnt fall out this early … Chile is a tough nut and Spain might have to beat them … assuming the Swiss beat Honduras.
The WC without Spain would leave only Portugal, Holland and Brazil as nominal “entertaining sides”. All three have their moments but none of them can give it like Spain.
Well, I guess there is always Argentina!
Arthur, stop hiding and holler back (re: last thread) :-)
ps: I think I’ve figured out why you went all emotional there … you figured I was making a backhanded jab at France cause it was filled with Adebayor-types? You know vacuous, clique loving, empty-headed belligrent types? I assure you I wasnt. :-)
To be fair as overrated/useless as Anelka is he is still twice the player Ade will ever be.
Is that below the belt?
If you say it is, I’ll apologize! :-D
I hope this Lauren Koscielny guy is being brought in as backup and we are still looking for another CB as well.
He has 1 year of experience in Ligue 1, no international or UEFA cup experience. Yes, he is in theory a good defender, he has a very clean tackle, excellent positioning, good speed, good header (attack-wise), but he is quite slight (i.e. not very robust physically).
All in all, he is by far a greater gamble than Vermaelen. Verm is the same age but had played FOUR years at a top Dutch team. He had played in the UEFA cup and in the Champions league and was a regular for Belgium.
I also dont understand why pay up to 10 mill for someone so un-distinguished when more physically robust and far more experienced players of the same age like Kjaer and Subotic cost similar or less (Kjaer buy-out clause is 8 million).
because Wenger has to be the one that “makes” that guy… he can’t come in already established… it doesn’t work in Arsene’s world.
(or rarely has he tried that)
even if we sign Koscielny, we SHOULD sign another CB… unless Sol signs up for the 1-year deal.
The Djourou situation makes this tricky. With Senderos gone and assuming Gallas and Silvestre go we only have the rehabilitating Djourou and Vermaelen. If we sign the French Pole that still only gives us 2 and a half (Djourou). I agree with Fred we need another body yet I agree with Stag the chances of that body being ready-made are very slim. Campbell is good for maybe 15 games which on paper sounds good, the problem is he can’t do consecutive games which means he’s not a viable backup…. more a bonus backup.
Sol Campbell isn’t it. While it was pleasant to see a guy come in and show a bit of backbone, quite a few of his challenges were very poor. He got the benefit of the doubt in the BPL because he’s English but if he made some of those challenges against Barcelona with a European referee, he would have conceded penalties or gotten himself sent off several times over.
Sol was a breath of fresh air because he was a better option than Silvestre and it’s nice to see a legend that still has it but let’s be real. There’s a reason he didn’t play against Barcelona. There’s a reason Capello didn’t bring him back into the England side. He was a good stop-gap but hardly good enough for Arsenal. Celtic is about as good as Sol Campbell is.
Yeah, Sol at this age has a good chance of “decaying” especially if not playing regularly enough.
What he brings extra though might be what we like to call “leadership” qualities.
With Cesc gone (?) I fear for this team.
Looks like Cesc misses out again today. Who the hell did the boy piss off?
Spain’s XI: Casillas; Ramos, Puyol, Piqué, Capdevila; Xabi Alonso, Xavi, Silva; Navas, Villa, Torres
Maybe he’s not fully fit?
Torres up front, Villa in for Iniesta and on the left, Silva dropped for Navas….And Villa scores a goal completely on his own! (Keeper might’ve done better?)
I would like to see Cesc on the pitch but Fred is right…They should keep Alonso or Busquets on as they tend to play deeper.
he’s just not good enough to start, and he did come on as a sub…
all good, they won 2-0, and there will be no complaints.
Looks like our new defender is in – Laurent Koscielny.
http://younggunsblog.co.uk/2010/06/arsenal-agree-koscielny-deal-with-youth-link-up/
This site is usually very reliable. Coquelin goes on loan to Lorient.
http://younggunsblog.co.uk/2010/06/francis-coquelin-joins-fc-lorient-on-loan/
Let us hope Koscielny is more Vermaelen than Cygan.
Sounds good to me….Now sign Sol to another one-year and get us a keeper….
Again I was impressed by Sorensen who stood tall against Cameroon despite a horror show from his central defenders. Admittedly the Cameroonians failed to put several of their numerous chances on target, but that may have been induced by knowing they had a decent keeper to beat.
The Swiss keeper is less than a half hour from his 2nd clean sheet, despite facing the formidable forces of Spain and now Chile while a man down. Behrami’s red card (for high hands while he was on the ball?) was absurd and maybe was based on his earlier (and normal for him) dangerous tackling. Swiss defense (so far) holding strong w/o Senderos nor Djourou….
Swiss defence finally fell but not before they created a new record for keeping a clean sheet (some 600 minutes).
Chile should have scored at least 5 but Swizz also had a glorious chance to make it 1-1 near the death.
Now it’s all about scoring goals against Honduras….Two wins (perhaps by multiple goals) and Spain top the group (avoiding Brazil in the round of 16). If Cesc helps orchestrate such a scenario, the clamor will only intensify….I’m very eager to see who Del Bosque puts out there today. Iniesta is the obvious one to leave out (due to injury), but I have yet to see the up-side in Busquets besides his diving and his height. If you need goals why not play ALL those guys (Iniesta, Cesc, Xavi and Silva–with Torres and Villa up front) and hope for the best at the back?
You cant play THAT midfield, because NONE of them is defensive.
You just cant play two smallish AMs in the center of your midfield and hope to get away with it.
It has never worked.
The Ivory Coast player’s acting that got Kaka sent off will hurt them more.
Portugal will face Brazil without Kaka and that only makes it easier for Portugal, not Ivory Coast.
After going down 3-0 … and having an extra game where you need your current opponents to win to have a chance why be overly aggressive against them.
Lets face facts, African teams dont really think in a strategic way.
Indiscipline, naivety, chaos and sometimes just plain old stupidity. Its always the same with them.
Well, now they have almost no chance.
What did you guys think about New Zealand’s goalkeeper? The kid looked awful sharp against the Italians. Also, I liked the big center forward who came on late for New Zealand; I think his name was Ross.
the keeper who impressed me most so far is that Nigeria keeper.
Messi could have scored a couple of goals already had not because of him.
though he too made a costly error spilling the ball and led to a goal conceded in their second match. He was otherwise unbeatable in two matches so far.
Oh, I haven’t seen anyone in this tournament that is as good as Almunia.
We are all set at keeper for years with Almunia and Fabianski… no chance for the other two!
But, since we only have Vermaelen and Djourou at CB, we might want to pick someone up on a free!
:)
love you Arsene!
mind u though, I believe it was ME and FRED who were the first two person on this site (in fact old AA)that raised the question mark on Almunia…. around two or three seasons ago.
Do u remember who’s the one who said “no team in England had won the league without a top class keeper?” I don’t recall you agreed with me back then. u were still moaning about Arsene shouldn’t have sold Patrick Vieira.
so cut the cheap shots. how about actually SUGGESTING something for a change? like who does you think should Arsenal bring in to replace Almunia?
huh?
I didn’t think we should have let Lehmann go without a proper replacement.
We never won SHIT since Vieira left. So, make of that what you will. When you don’t attempt to even replace starters that leave, you leave HOLES in your team.
Be it Lehmann, Vieira or Pires.
I don’t CARE who we bring in to replace Almunia… frankly, because there are 10 KEEPERS who we could, that are DEFINITELY better than he is, so it would improve the team immediately.
SCHWARZER, GREEN, FRIEDEL, HOWARD, HART, GIVEN, SORENSEN… these are all guys we could get, are older… and wouldn’t command big money… and while some will say “he isn’t good” … blah blah blah… they are ALL better than Almunia and Fabianski… in my humble opinion.
Wenger will go for whomever he wants and if he wants to.
If it happens, I will be happy, if it doesn’t I WON’T BE SURPRISED… nor should anyone.
their player deserved to be carded for diving yet I’m aware I’m biased so I’ll let you guys be the judge!
————————————-
Kiwi, if I were to be the judge, you know what I would say! ;)
Frankly, when first I heard the whistle blew, and watching the ref rushing into the penalty box full with excitement, I thought he was going to book that Italian player for attempting to make a fool out of him.
Until I realized that Italian player had succeeded.
vibe, I always believe luck plays a factor in football, in life, in everything indeed. But luck is something beyond anyone’s control.
Refereeing decision on the pitch, it’s within a person’s control. That person is the ref.
When a keeper makes a mistake, he’s going to get punished. In Rob Green’s case, he was dropped.
When a ref makes a mistake, you can be sure we will see him again the next match.
The ref’s job is difficult? Sure it is. So is the keepers, the defenders, strikers, managers….
Mistake is mistake. A poor performance is a poor performance. When an Arsenal player play poorly in a match, will you be saying “he’s only human”?
So why the referee is an exception?
Another point is – because of the fact a ref is very much capable on committing a crucial mistake in a big match, just as much as in a meaningless friendly. That’s the main cause for concern.
As far as I’m concerned, they had very much helped to write a different football history.
Because of their mistakes, England had won the WC 1966. Messi might not be able to win the CL with Barca as Chelsea were clearly robbed in the semi. Our unbeaten side of 2004/5 could have hit the magic 50. And how on earth South Korea could break into WC semi had not because of that little help from the man in black?
here’s just a few high profile examples. Now tell me that Arsenal side of 2004/5 were not good enough.
So stop looking for EXCUSE for the ref.
That’s a long post that still manages to completely ignores the main thrust of my point.
If the US plays better in the first half, one mistake by the referee doesn’t get a chance to loom so large. And that’s not just according to me, that’s the word of the USMNT.
Comparing referees and players is beyond apples and oranges. Robert Green has zero relevance to this conversation. But playing along, if England made more of their chances, one soft goal by the US doesn’t earn a draw. Fact is, England doesn’t have great GK options, and they haven’t played well, generally. So pretend that one goal tells the tell of England’s performance so far, or that one call is why the US didn’t beat Slovenia, but I don’t see a convincing argument above. Hey, why aren’t Managers who make one mistake dropped? Or why hasn’t Arsenal brought in ANY top class GKs? (Don’t bother answering, all those questions are as irrelevant. It just goes to show EVERYONE makes mistakes in football. Winning teams minimize theirs so that the bad calls and bad bounces most often aren’t enough to do them in.)
And either quote where I made EXCUSES for the ref, or acknowledge that’s something you made up out of thin air and your thinner argument.
ONE mistake by the ref, of course, doesn’t get a chance to loom large… if we are talking about awarding a throw in to a wrong side.
short enough for you? the reply?
Enough to make the point that you have no real response to my original argument, yes. Thank you.
But what if it’s a 0-0 or 1-1 game that has been tight and well played and the ref fucks up that same call? At some point the work of the officials DOES come in to play and you can’t use that “well if so and so played better from the start” arguement. Should the USMT have played a better game from the beginning? Of course and if they do maybe they aren’t in that same position, but the ref’s work had a very obvious detrimental effect on the outcome. How many times in sports have we seen great comebacks, whether it be soccer, football, baseball, etc.? If the ref makes a mistake then that magical story doesn’t happen.
Can’t comment England WC’66 since I wasn’t there. However, if England undeservedly won the WC in 66, don’t you think that they deservedly punished in ’86 at the hand of Maradona?
This might not be popular, as it’s relevant to Arsenal 49 unbeaten run. Should we criticize Wiley for the decision he made in this game? Or, was it because it was in favor of Arsenal, so he deserves praise?
Ref made mistake for awarding penalty to Man Utd that ended the unbeaten run. The ref also made mistake that made the unbeaten run possible.
Equilibrium didn’t only make it to our high school physic, it appears that it also messes around with football too.
Right on.
Or maybe as Landon Donovan says…
“We all understand the reality of it. We’ve all played in enough games where those things happen and through the course of your career they tend to even out. So a lot of us have been on the good side of something like that, and unfortunately this time we were on the bad side of something like that. It happens. You get on with it. There’s absolutely nothing we can do about it right now, so we focus on Wednesday.”
What is an absolute joke is Blatter’s arrogance and belief that FIFA never owes anyone an explanation.
I’m not a fan of baseball, but the way MLB/Jim Joyce/Armando Gallaraga handled the mistake that cost the latter his perfect game…shames FIFA’s approach to officiating.
I liked watching Ryan Nelsen the All White captain give the Italian player an earful after the dive. Of course it changes nothing yet it’s just refreshing to see a battle-hardened captain sticking up for his team. Nelsen captains Blackburn which understandably won’t get the neutrals swooning, yet there’s a touch of Tony Adams about him – cut from the same granite. If your facing a team that’s out to intimidate you or take liberties its nice to have a Nelsen type as your skipper.
Similarly, he always gives 100%, he’s beligerent and doesn’t give up, not the most artistic of players, yet he’s a CB – the guys who used to be called ‘stoppers’. If captains help to shape the attitude of the team then a bit of Ryan is a good thing.
http://www.3news.co.nz/Goals-All-Whites-vs-Italy/tabid/317/articleID/161831/Default.aspx
Hey guys, thanks Armchair, yes another lovely result for NZ. Football is a truly wicked game, the margins are so small. Results often hinge on one play. Not surprising Italy scored a penalty from a typically cynical piece of play-acting – they’re the masters of doing enough – quite honestly in all my years following football I’ve never seen much to admire about them aside from the rather important fact that they are often ultimately successful!! :-) For me a number of national sides over the years have inspired and brought joy to the game…. the Dutch, Brazil of course, even the Danes, yet never the Italians.
With the penalty, their player deserved to be carded for diving yet I’m aware I’m biased so I’ll let you guys be the judge!!
I’m just thrilled we’re being so competitive and have a cohesive playing syle – the team knows what they do which is more than can be said for some of the superpowers.
Yes Sachin, it would be an amazing thing for our team to progress to the next round. Whatever happens, it’s been a neat thing for NZ football.
Kiwi – totally agree. Italy has always been my least favorite of the major national teams. BORING. Germany and Brazil win just as much, and are entertaining. From a neutral’s POV it’s an easy choice.
As for the PK, that was definitely a dive, but even had he not gone down, a PK could have been given for that huge shirt pull. It would’ve been a soft one, yes, but I’ve seen ’em given for less.
This is another reason I don’t like Italy: diving. Who knows what would’ve happened in the last World Cup if whats-his-face from Italy hadn’t dove inside the Aussie box to win a totally frivolous, scandalous, undeserved PK? They’re quite the masters of deception if you ask me.
De Rossi exaggerated the fall (a.k.a dive) after the shirt pulling incident. Unless the ref had clear view, it’s probably hard for the ref not to award the penalty.
Fabiano clearly handled the ball twice, one with each arm, in his 2nd goal. He uses one arm to bring the ball down the first time around and then uses the other arm before lining up his shot. Yet, it has gone largely un-noticed. Even the commentator let it go lightly as well. Is it not a big deal because this was Brazil and the opponent was not a British team? :)
I guess the Guardian play by play deals with the handball appropriately:
GOAL! Brazil 2-0 Ivory Coast (Fabiano 50) Superb again from the Sevilla striker. Dinks the ball over Zokora, dinks the ball over Touré, (then brings the ball down with his arm), before cracking another fizzing shot past Barry. More than a hint of controversy about that one, but the skill was sublime in the build up.
As long as the skill is sublime, then its okay. What is funny about the whole thing is the ref points to his arm to Fabiano in the replay and Fabiano says no, then the ref points to his chest and smiles it off. Ofcourse, the goal really had no bearing on the outcome. It was not clearly visible probably. If all those years ago, Diego could get away with a more blatant punch, then Fabiano’s arm attempt was minor, but it was a double juggle all right.
The first one looked accidental to me, but the second one was more intentional to bring the ball down. But, he mixed them up with lob plays brilliantly that might have caused the refs/ref’s assistance jaw to drop to call for foul :)
Yeah I think you are right. Here on Canadian tv, they agreed it was a double handball but still called it a beautiful goal and beautiful piece of skill. I just have a hard time calling it beautiful because for me even though the first handball may be accidental, it paved the way for the entire move.
IC got what they deserved – nothing.
Kaka will miss the Portugal game and that is even worse news for IC.
Brazil are ripping IC apart.
Eboue just need to dive 3 times to save IC ;)
Darn. Sven sub’d him.
Drogba dives, no issues.
Kaka doesn’t hurt a fly, but he is sent off.
Hmm…
That puzzles me too. Keita ran and bumped onto Kaka and he got yellow?
On the hand, it might be a good rest for Kaka since Brazil has already qualified.
This world cup is going the way of 2002.
Remember when we had those predictions 2 threads ago where we all predicted who would go out of the tournament first? Hands up if you had Cameroon! No one did. But we all had one prediction right- that we would get our predictions wrong.
So far the first WC held in Africa has not benefited African teams a whole lot, nor has the “European” weather benefited European teams. It is South America that has been dominating.
Asians team (Korea and Japan) have done ok so far.
@ Arthur, check out my response to your emotional blabbing in the last thread. Keep the hormonal response to a minimum … just logical points please :-)
:-)
I keep thinking of 2002 when comparing to the current world cup. France, Italy, Portugal and England all struggled in 2002 with players appearing tired and un-interested, especially the French in 2002. Spain won all their group games but their exit was shrouded in controversy. Germany did better by getting to the final although they did it on the back of three 1-0 results.
And now, you have some of the same countries struggling but for different reasons. Is it that the current crop of top European countries players struggle or are not interested when the tournament is away from Europe? Maybe that logic will be tested in 4 years time in Brazil?
Ironically, Domenech has coached France for more games than any other person.
Kiwi :) NZ are one win from the second round?
Wow – ENGLAND, FRANCE, and ITALY – all crapping it up big time. Will Spain continue?
Superb effort from NZ. Well done All White (All Black?), Kimi …
NZ hold Italy !!!
Say what you will, I am enjoying this World Cup.
me too, starting with the narrow win for Brazil over N. Korea.
European teams can’t play WC in the winter?
Surprising, isn’t it?
I thought the Europeans are supposed to deal with the winter a lot better than others.
Maybe they are not supposed to win outside their continent. ;)
So has the world ended now from an Italian perspective? :) As they say, misery loves company. Maybe the French and English can seek some company in their misery.
The french situation is not surprizing. Domenech has had some bizarre clashes/disagreements with players in the past such as Vikash Dhorasoo (although he did film inside the locker room), Giuly and even Pires. Apparently few years ago, Giuly had sent a text message to Domenech’s girlfriend that caused Raymond to get upset and leave him off the team. Although Giuly claimed he didn’t know the woman was Raymond’s girlfriend. Not sure what the problem with Pires was. Leaving Domenech in charge was clearly an incorrect decision from a player perspective. I always thought there were pent up player frustrations with Domenech that didn’t come out, and you occasionally got words of support for Domenech from some players such as Viera. But now things are unraveling in full public view.
Will Evra now lead a hunt into finding the traitor in the locker room?
The argument this time was between the team trainer and Evra, so Evra isnt going to lead anything.
The team should have been purged four years ago once Zidane retired.
“France refused to train on Sunday because of striker Nicolas Anelka’s expulsion, according to a letter written by them and read out to the media by coach Raymond Domenech.”
Andez
June 18th, 2010 at 8:03 pm
Whenever I criticized the refs at the past, you got some “no-nonsense” fellow came out and accusing me of seeking “excuse”.
Now, I’m not an US fan, and Arsenal were not involved, I would still wanna say – the refs are crap.
One of them probably singlehandly robbed away a US victory again Slovenia. That THIRD goal from US which was disallowed for…. what?
now tell me I’m talking EXCUSE.”
You got it.
While the referee made a crap decision, he did not cost the US the match. By the admission of many US players, their own complacency was as much or more to blame. If you don’t wait until you’re behind the start playing, have to fight just get to get the match back even, then it’s not in the idiot referee’s hands at the last minute.
So bad referring, bad luck, but mostly bad US form in the first half. In football, you only control what you can control. I was proud the US men had the good grace to not make EXCUSES and to accept their culpability. There was no EXCUSE for their first half performance.
Just watched NZ take their first (WC) lead ever against Italy, on an obviously offside goal. That leaves Italy 84 minutes to overcome that mistake. Like the weather, and the odd bounce of the ball, all part of the game.
I feel like revisiting my middle school math for some reasons.
WC group stage can be considered as whole season of PL since
each team has equal opportunity to play each other. In WC, each
team has 3 chances, while in PL, each team has 38 chances.
So, US had 1 bad call; which translates to 50% bad call per game.
Asssuming that there won’t be bad call in the last game, the ratio
will be 33%. How many did Arsenal got bad call in PL? Let’s say 5.
That’s about 13%, which is far less than 33%. Arsenal has to get
about 12 bad calls if they were to equate 33%. I don’t recall
Arsenal had that many bad calls. So, I agree with you. Until Arsenal
improve the squad on par with whoever above them, complaining about
bad call is moot point.
By the way Vibe, the ball hit Cannavaro first before Smeltz hit it
home. So, it wasn’t offside as far as I know.
AC, I did wonder about that deflection, so you may be right. The positioning of Smeltz (I think) still looked a touch dubious to me, but if it was legal, all the better.
And, in any case, imagine the absurdity of the Italians blaming the draw on that (non) call.
@”Until Arsenal
improve the squad on par with whoever above them, complaining about
bad call is moot point.”
And that brings it all back (to our) home. That an the anti-Arsenal officiating conspiracies mentioned on the other thread…it’s all silly. Play better than the other team for 90 minutes, 99.999% of the time, that’ll be enough to overcome the inevitable bad calls. That’s the math of football.
SO basically what has happened as best I can put togther –
French team arrives for training – the team trainer and Domenech argue. Team trainer tosses his credentials at Domenech and resigns. French managing director, announces fight, and then resigns.
Team fed up boards bus and leaves without training.
Ladies and gentleman I give you – As The French Team Turns
The team trainer argued with Evra, not Domenech.
Wow, if you thought England were in crisis, what do you call the French?
As you sow, so shall you reap!
When France continued with Domenech after Euro2008, they always ran the risk of something like this happening.
They really a clean sweep, err…, broom. :)
Curious to know what AW comment would be.
Blanc has tough job ahead cleaning up the mess.
I think Blanc has an easy job.
When you hit rock bottom, there is only way to go – up.
And expectations will also be low after this fiasco.
Blanc has much better crendential when he was a player. That might help him getting some respects from group of player he will assemble.
French team refuses to train today. Managing director resigns.
Heard about it during Italy – NZ game today. Also heard that Anelka was sent home? What’s up with that? Did they accidentally press the self-destruct button?