A Fan’s Perspective – Why Wenger Should Stay
Editor’s Note: I placed a call out to fans yesterday for one writer to defend Wenger and another to make the case against. I was surprised to get a request from a follower of mine @15yogooner – I was skeptical at first but said sure. The piece below is well thought out and very well written. So enjoy!!! – DAG.
As a teenager, I’ve only ever known Arsenal under the management of Arsene Wenger. I’ve been an Arsenal ‘fan’ all my life, but I became a real ‘supporter’ during our final season at Highbury, when I began going to more and more games. As such, I haven’t truly experienced the glory and emotion of seeing my team winning silverware – when we won our last trophy in 2005, I was playing for my 7-a-side team, and missed most of the game. These days I would never miss an occasion like that – in fact, I went to our most recent cup final. Back then, I didn’t have the same emotional connection and attachment to the Arsenal as I do now.
Seeing as I haven’t had that true feeling of winning a trophy, my best Arsenal moments have been individual moments, single games like our victories over Juventus and Real Madrid in the Champions League, or the more recent unbelievable triumph over Barcelona at the Grove. In the league, my highlights would be beating Chelsea this season, thumping Sp*rs 3-0 and Gallas’ last-gasp equaliser against United – I may hate him now but for that moment, I will always have a tiny bit of respect for him deep down. He cared – perhaps not about the club, as shown by his move across the North London divide, but about winning. Perhaps that’s what Arsene needs to instil into his current crop of players – winning is everything.
Which brings me back to the subject of this post. Arsene Wenger. The man who led us to two league & cup doubles, the Champions League final, and of course that amazing unbeaten run, stretching across three seasons. 49 games. A feat that remains untouched, and will probably not be beaten in the rest of my lifetime. He assembled a team of winners, players that would do anything for victory, like Gallas as I said before. Vieira, Henry, Bergkamp, Campbell, Pires, Ljungberg, Gilberto, Lauren, Toure, Lehmann and, dare I say it, Cole. Every single one of those players were consistently good. Off-days were rare, and even when we had them, we still pulled a result out of the fire somehow. Most of those players had been signed for a paltry fee by Arsene, and nurtuted into genuinely world class players. Sol was already a good player, but Arsene pulled a masterstroke by getting him to leave Sp*rs. Cole joined the club as a teenager about a year after Arsene joined, and was developed into a terrific player. Bergkamp had been signed by Bruce Rioch just before Arsene joined.
Fast forward six or seven years, let’s compare the teams. Szczesny – plucked from Poland by Wenger after his scouts recommended him. A good goalkeeper, who seems destined to become great, and he has a great attitude. No problems there – until we go lower through the ranks to find Manuel Almunia, who is a disaster that happens every time we play him. However, what would have happened if Lehmann, Stuart Taylor and Graham Stack had all been injured at the same time during the Invincibles season? Rami Shabaan would have played – I’m not sure he was any better than Almunia. I don’t think Arsene can be blamed for the current goalkeeping situation; it’s so rare that so many goalkeepers at a club are injured at the same time.
At right back, we have Bacary Sagna in place of Lauren. Similar types and levels of player, but Lauren would contribute a little more in attack I think. He was an unsung hero, with terrific spirit and a will to win. Sagna is similar, but perhaps not as much of a character – more quiet, definitely not as vocal as his predecessor. Our central defence partnership of choice would probably be Vermaelen and Djourou, as opposed to Toure and Campbell. Kolo and Sol both had their weaknesses, but when one of them slipped up, you could be sure the other would be there to clear up the danger. We can’t particularly judge Thomas and Johan as a partnership, as they’ve barely played together, but I’m not sure they’d be as solid as Sol and Kolo. The latter duo cost us about £250,000 in total, while Vermaelen cost £10 million on his own. At left back, there really is no arguing – as a player, Cole is far better than Gael Clichy. Gael has a good attitude, but is definitely not on Cole’s level in either attack or defence. A lot of times he costs us goals, and rarely does he supply goals anymore.
In midfield, I think we can compare Walcott and Ljungberg – only one winner. Freddie was obviously nowhere near as quick as Walcott with his feet, but his footballing brain far surpasses Theo’s. He scored and assisted so many goals, and was a vital piece of the puzzle. As for the Vieira/Gilberto duo compared to the midfield pivot of Song & Wilshere, you’d probably take the former every time, despite Wilshere’s progress. Song is also a good player, but Patrick and Gilberto were such an effective partnership – sitting deep and protecting the defence, with Vieira usually striding forward in attack. He was especially effective on the counter, with his speed of thought and movement, his eye for a pass better than perhaps given credit for. Both had won World Cups by this point, while Jack and Alex are only just beginning their senior careers – the future is bright, and Arsene has done well pairing them together in midfield. On the left, Robert Pires was a simply majestic player, so important in the run, contributing many important goals. Samir Nasri is a similar player to Bobby, conjuring up magic every now and then – but not as often. He goes missing in games still, while Pires would nearly always be relied on in any game.
Seeing as the formations were different, it’s difficult to compare the rest of the players, but Fabregas and Bergkamp probably play the most similar roles. Both dropping deep to pick the ball up, and lurking outside the box to set others up, although Dennis would often be in the box to finish off moves. Cesc is a few years younger than Dennis was, so you can understand why DB10 was a better player than our captain is now, but I don’t see any reason why Fabregas can’t be as good at his age. Wenger has done so well in his handling of Cesc – signing him in an excellent swoop, and helping him mature so well into the player he is now. Finally, the ‘out-and-out strikers’, Thierry Henry and Robin van Persie. Of course, there’s only one winner, but keep in mind Henry was £10.5 million in 1999. In 2003, Robin was snapped up for just £3 million. Nowadays, £3 million would be more like £8 million, and £10.5 million roughly £20 million.
Which brings me onto one of the most discussed topics in terms of Arsene’s reign – the money he has spent. The Invicibles starting XI cost a total of £43.85 million, while our current strongest first eleven came to a rough cost of £38 million. The fact that we are still challenging for the league with such a difference in the costs of the teams (taking into account the inflation of the market these days) is a credit to Arsene. People call for his head because he doesn’t spend enough money – but has he been able to? The Emirates Stadium cost £470 million. Over the last five years, we’ve had to pay off that debt by selling players for a profit and by raising ticket prices. However, despite selling so many key players and buying for such low prices, we’ve managed to stay in the Champions League, strongly challenging for the league at least three times out of the five seasons. Without Arsene, would all of that have been possible? No is the answer.
This new stadium will help us be as big a club as we are long after Arsene leaves. He was hugely involved in the project of building the Emirates, and has been the one to steady the ship consistently every time we’ve wobbled. I have no doubts that he’s the one to take us through this so-called “crisis” and set us on the road for further glories. He’s our most successful manager ever, and the only reason we’ve gone without trophies for a few years is because he wants us to be able to win even more trophies in the future. That future was discussed eagerly about five years ago – we’re getting closer and closer to the promises being fulfilled. He is definitely not incapable of spending – before the move to the Emirates he wasn’t afraid to spend big, as the cost of our best eleven shows. Since the move, he’s had to operate on a low budget, and has still managed to bring players into the club who are now excellent, thanks to his guidance.
If we got rid of him now, who would come in? Who would give us Champions League football year in year out, no matter the financial situation, and even mastermind wins over the teams that were at the time heralded as the greatest in the world, like Real and Barcelona? I can’t imagine anyone else could do the same job as him. And now, we’re struggling a little, we’ve drawn our last three games I think. And our fans are getting angrier and angrier at Wenger. There was so much praise for the players after the win against Barcelona – but now, when things aren’t going as well, it’s Arsene those same people blame. Some people have very strange memories. It was he who got the tactics spot on against Barcelona, and it paid off. His tactics are still working fairly well, despite some questionable decisions, but the players have lost confidence and aren’t playing as well. It’s not all because of Wenger.
So next time you criticise Wenger, remember that record-breaking run, remember those sensational doubles, and all of those amazing results he helped us pull off. We wouldn’t be where we are without him.
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Dictator Wenger is going FULL Ghadafi on non-Wenger-worshippers!!!
“How dare they question me”, the French Twat says.
Ofcourse he gives the usual CRAP about “other teams spending 10 times more” because OTHER teams affect us buying a CB or a GK to strengthen our team. The FUCKING LIAR.
Amongst other delusional crap he also pretty much tells us Top Four is better than a trophy!!!
All packaged under the Second Place is Good Enough heading on BBC.
The amount of utter delusion in that article is why people absolutely DETEST Wenger. I can not wait for the day Wenger is shot out of a canon out of London and back to France. The git.
——————————————————————–
He also adds in a nice little lie about how in the Barca game, Arsenals average age was 23 while Barca was 27.
First of all, our starting age was 24.5 and at the end, it was 25.5. Barca’s was around 26.5. Big whoopty-doo!!
Second, who gives a crap about age? Third, is he admitting he is permanently keeping his team young so he can continue having nice little excuses to feed his AKB sheep?
LOL.
@Fred,
And don’t forget…
“I am only very proud of what this team has done. I will defend that until the end. I have to be proud because if I took statements from the media at the start of the season we were not even in the top five. Now it is a scandal we are second. Where is the common sense?”
As to that last question, indeed.
That is TRULY music to my ears. I am happy a newspaper in England actually published the “list” … so that the affected players themselves can see their sorry faces on the canned list. The punks!
The list is however NOT complete, it fails to list Diaby, Squillaci and Vela. Those three MUST go.
Diaby and Squillaci might be a bit more obvious but Vela has FAILED completely. He can’t even get into a garbage West Brom squad and that tells us all we need to know about his work ethic or talent.
So we now have a consensus. The Terrible Ten must go.
Lansbury (for Denilson), Frimpong (for Diaby), Miyaichi (for Vela), JET (for Bendtner), Bartley (for Squillaci), Jenkinson (for Eboue) returning will at least balance out six of the departing ten.
We then need a:
1) a solid LB (non-negotiable) to replace Clichy.
2) a solid GK (non-negotiable) to replace Almunia. If CZ or Fabianski don’t like it, they can go fuck themselves.
3) a solid experienced DM (non-negotiable). We can and will NOT win anything without a proper DM. Song and Frimpong are just NOT good enough yet.
4) A livewire, electric winger type AM to replace Arshavin.
Sure, some AKBs will claim all this is a lot of work …. but the club should have been filling this holes for YEARS and that is why it has come to a head.
For me, as long as the Terrible Ten leave, I will be happy for next season. We won’t have ANY chance of competing for the title without buying in those four positions listed but at the very least, I don’t have to see the faces of loser players every weekend.
@Fred,
I don’;t see all yout 10 going. That’s just too much movement in one season. I do see like 6 of them out of here.
As for Vela – He doesn’t get into West Brom – because Woy is setting that squad up defencively. The worst thing that happened was when DiMatteo got canned. Vela was never going to play regularly with Woy. Woy doesn’t know how to use attacking players.
@DaAdminGooner,
As long as Denilson, Eboue and Almunia are in that six, it is still a net positive.
For me if all Ten go (and we buy absolutely no one as expected) the team is already better – in mentality, in belief, in hardwork and in speed.
As for Vela, Roy Hodgson did not play a defensive game at Fulham so I dont see what you are getting at. Just because he failed at Liverpool doesnt make him a bad manager. He just might not be a “big-club” manager.
That said, I am certain he (nor anyone else) is fond of Vela’s lazy, don’t care attitude that we saw at Arsenal.
@Fred, Glad to see you getting excited about the “future”….It should be a “fun” Spring and Summer discussing these matters….(winky face, of course….)
The Daily Heil has listed some transfer targets by name, as you have by position. Shall we start to put the two together or should we wait until we’re mathematically eliminated? No matter what, I think we (the armchair managers) should do a hair more than just saying things like “We’re a top club with ample resources and an expensive scouting network”….Which is akin (somewhat, at least) to saying that Arsene Knows Best…..
Re: Carlitos Vela….I have a soft spot for him, mostly because all my Mexican football people here favor Chicarito AND ManUnited. He is highly skilled, a great “heads up” player (i.e. usually a playmaker with shades of Cesc in his game) AND in his few minutes on the pitch for WBA, he has secured them a couple of (important) late draws. He needs to show that he can play effectively for long stretches and the loan (thus far) hasn’t given him the chance. (Managers, I’ve been told, aren’t always right, by the way….) Hopefully in these remaining games…. And perhaps, if he leads Mexico to a successful defense of their Gold Cup this summer, a few pesos will be on offer to get him back over there….
But let’s not get ahead of ourselves….A roller coaster ride on the Northern seaside looms…..
@highburyterracesteve,
“No matter what, I think we (the armchair managers) should do a hair more than just saying things like “We’re a top club with ample resources and an expensive scouting network”….Which is akin (somewhat, at least) to saying that Arsene Knows Best…..”
It’s really not at all the same. It’s a fact that Arsenal is a wealthy club that has great resources.
It’s an opinion that Arsene Knows Best. And an increasingly silly one, at that.
I’ve tended to agree about Vela. I really thought he’d be successful with us. Then I *hoped* he would be. Now I believe I was wrong in the first place.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1375076/Arsenal-clearout–Arshavin-Clichy-Bendtner-Gonners.html
Music to my ears.
The only one who hit the top level was Arshavin; he’s show glimpses since he got out of his tailspin, and I think he would thrive with an influx of better talent. But all the others are ready to be shipped out.
@macmac007,
I know that DAG has referenced others rumors along these lines for a couple of weeks. I’ll believe it when I see it.
But what a good laugh it would be if Wenger finally figured out what some of us having been seeing for years.
Come join the realist party, Arsene. Please.
I’m a card carrying AKBer (wierd but I don’t know what the acronym itself stands for) and I won’t apologize for it. If you aren’t you can skip this post. This one’s going to be long (sorry about posting it twice too)
What the old timers say.
We’ve had a few members of the invincibles come back to train with this squad and they’ve generally had nothing but good to say about the potential/ability of the present squad. I don’t see a reason why any of them would lie about what they felt about the squad either. Lesson: So ability is not the problem
We are 2nd in the league. Go figure!
Yes, we are. Wierd thing is, I had a dream yesterday nite that Chelsea was 2nd and we were 3rd in the league. And it sure as hell may happen or maybe my subconscious is telling me what I really believe. But until then, and with 9 games (or thereabout to go), we are 2nd in a marathon of 38 games with more than a 3rd gone. We also have the outside chance of actually coming first. I’d assume that to get to such a position you need a little bit of ability or fight. Lesson: once again, ability is not the problem
On the other hand, who in this team will make it into Chelsea’s first team
Say it with me – 1. Okay, that’s a subjective answer, but I think only RVP in the squads we’ve been playing lately will make it into a first team. Now this may sound like blasphemy but I think the same was the case with the invincibles. Only, perhaps, Viera and DB10 (yes, no TH14) would have been able to walk into any of the top teams in their era at their peak. Lesson: Arsenal, under Wenger, has always been an unbelievably unique experience and never really so much about normalcy. Put another way, Arsene has, quite frankly, always been exceptional given his squads
So let’s get realistic (lemme play Stag)
No disrespect Stag, I could have chosen a dozen more names but you strike me as the bell ringer of the non-AKBers. And that in a subtle way is a complement ;)
Ok, seriously, there’s something wrong with this team. I know it. You know it. Arsene knows it. 5 years ago I knew it would take about 5 years for a team of 19/20 year olds to grow into winning the league. That expectation was almost cut shut when Hleb (I liked him, you know) and Flamini ably aided by the Dade and a few others almost pulled that one season wonder. You see, all the greatest teams, generally have a generous number of 26/25 year olds and not 19/20 year old boy wonders. But now, 5 years on, Clichy/Sagna/Cesc/Song/RVP/Verminator/Kos all at about their best years, we are still bottling games and losing battles. Something is wrong with this team alright. We may not all agree on what exactly it is – injuries, bottle (notice how that word can be used positively or negatively?), hard work, determination, technical ability, character (Arsene’s favorite?), drive, coaching inneptitude. Lesson is something is wrong with the team. We may differ on what’s wrong but something is not yet right with this team
Is this Barca or it is Arsenal
One of the problems with supporting Arsenal is understanding the club’s philosophy on and off the pitch. Arsenal is not Barca-lite. Their attacking philosophies are only similar so far as it pertains to one-dimensionality of their ball retention and passing. Barca’s will not work in the EPL. They’ll be a top 5 team with 3/4 of their players croked 4/5 of the time in the EPL. Arsenal will be a top 5 team in La Liga with far less of their players hurt. Where Barca play short passes with a generous sprinkling individual dribbling. Arsenal plays (or strives to play) complete team football with… side-ways passes at top speed :). In defense, it’s the exact opposite. Barca defend as a team whereas we leave Kos/Squill/Gael to continually embarrass themselves at the least provocation.
Ok, there’s no lesson here. I just felt I should rant a little
So what’s the point?
Arsenal is not going to change till the end of the season. What we’ve got is what we’ve got. Coming back here over and over again to tell me you were right at the start of the season when the season has not ended is… pointless – especially considering that nothing’s going to change for worse from now till the end of the season (it can’t get worse than not making top 4, right?). If anything, there’s a slight chance now with support and encouragement whatever little character is left in this team might just manifest (now you know why I’m a card carrying AKBer). I’m not saying don’t rant after a game that feels like a waste of 90 minutes. I even recommend you rant, curse and puff. But don’t do it continually when there’s that small chance that you could impact the team positively.
Here’s the thing. The reason we are Arsenal fans (especially the < 30 year-old lot of us that started following the team under Wenger's era) is that he managed to bring out the AKB in us. With a teams that, individually, aren't the best, he has always managed to do the phenominal. That's why I support this team. Kanu, Edu, Wiltord, Gilberto, Parlor, Adams e.t.c. were not complete players but achieved what they did within the confines of the Arsenal philosophy. It was a team that dared to believe. And believing, it dared to achieve. And boy, did it achieve some awesome stuff. We still see that potential to achieve in this team. Yes, something is missing, but you know that’s the beauty of been an AKB – it’s almost like this project is ours (regardless of the parts we are more than willing to ditch – Denilson, anybody?).
Lesson: Liverpool fans sing you’ll never walk alone even when everybody know their team sucks
@mishel,
Ofcourse the old-timers coming back to use our facilities would say nice thing. Its common courtsy, you expect them to bash the failed project while free-loading on the fitness facilities? Come on now.
RvP can NOT make it into Man U or Chelsea’s first team. He is worse than their strikers.
Fabregas is our ONLY player who can walk into those two first teams.
@Fred,
Sorry Fred – Name one Chelsea striker who has been as good as RvP this season? Anelka? Nope. Drogba – Nope. Torres – CERTAINLY NOT. RvP makes Chelsea easily.
United – Rooney just came on. Berba and Chicarito are the only ones I couldn’t see RvP displacing. Though Berba has disappeared of late.
RvP is good enough for those squads – easily.
@DaAdminGooner,
Drogba and Torres are DEFINITELY better than RvP. The Dutchman will sit on the bench at Chelsea.
Drogba and Torres are faster, stronger, better in the air, and more clinical than RvP on average. Their class is permanent. The good news is that RvP is not that far behind – apart from in speed and strength.
Rooney, Hernandez and Berbatov BEAT RvP day and night. At Man U he will be their Vela.
Rooney has everything Van Persie has … and he is faster and stronger. Hernandez and Berbatov have subliminal skills that would make Bergy proud and RvP jealous.
Anelka v. RvP is a close contest and pretty much depends on personal preference. Personally I will go for Anelka because he is more physically robust and has speed. Can you imagine a team defending a corner with RvP the furthest striker and RvP being played thru from the halfway line alone, but with a defender in close hot pursuit?
No way! The defender will catch him and crunch tackle him down before he can leave the center circle!!
There were 3 one-sided results in the CL and today 3 more high scoring results in the Europa. So going into the second legs, 4 teams have a 4 goal lead and the other two have 3 goal leads. Only Schalke managed a huge away win in these 6 ties. Very remote chance the second legs for these 6 ties will be interesting or produce an upset. Only 1 tie out of 8 European games and just a single 1-0 game. Quite surprizing.
I hear Jeremie Aliadiere is “tearing it up” in the Reserves …. I imagine the AKBs at Young Guns are jizzing themselves in glee at his prospects.
What are the chances Wenger will sign him up for next season??? LOL!
His wikipedia page already has him as an “Arsenal striker”.
Dear Lord!
I am really looking forward to seeing Denilson, Almunia and Aliadiere (in place of Arshavin) starting next season!
Man U pretty much have the EPL and FA cup LOCKED. They are on cruise control in both.
They pretty much just have to hold their nerve to get to the CL final and have a chance for the treble.
Amazing really, when everyone (including Ferguson and Man U fans) agree that this is one of their worst squads in years. While Wenger claims, that his current squad is his best squad EVER! LOL!
Tactically, Ferguson shits all over Wenger.
The funniest part is that the former always says he isnt that good tactically and constantly seeks help (usually by hiring assistants) and by NOT being a stubborn git.
WHILE our French Twat thinks he knows it all despite being a tactical buffoon. He refuses any help, any fresh opinion on anything and just continues in his failed, delusional path.
I made myself watch the Chelsea-United match yesterday and, in the end, it was interesting. Both teams seemed content to sit back and the result was a cagey match with only the one goal from Boswinga doing a his best Clichy/Gibbs imitation….Overall it was painful, as both teams have greater depth and quality than we do, even though I’m far from impressed by either squad. This years winner will almost certainly be from Spain….
Though it pains me to say it, I have to admire that SAF can start players like Nani and Berbatov on the bench, take a lead and then have the moxy to sub them in. Somehow, I don’t see our own manager using “offense as defense”, despite our claims to being dedicated to attack….
That being said, Chelsea were awfully unlucky to not score and it was a stonewall penalty there at the end (Evra on Ramires). The reffing in the CL, I think, might even be worse than what we see week to week in the PL…..
Looking forward to some wild board room news (maybe?) and some team news (Song/Cesc re-crocked, Nasri concussed, but still with more brain than Theo?) ahead of the trip to Blackpool…..
@highburyterracesteve, HTS.
The Winner of the CL could easily be Chelsea or United.
They play Schalke (unless Inter somehow come back from down 5-2)… which means they winner of ManU/Chelsea will be highly favored to make the final against the winner of Barca/Real Madrid.
One game. vs. Barca or Madrid…
Either United or Chelsea are good enough to win a one-off match. A bad call, a fluke goal, a sending off… and the match is completely changed.
I like Barcelona’s chances against anyone left in the CL as well.
But in a one game Final, United could easily take them down.
@highburyterracesteve, HTS.
The Winner of the CL could easily be Chelsea or United.
They play Schalke (unless Inter somehow come back from down 5-2)… which means they winner of ManU/Chelsea will be highly favored to make the final against the winner of Barca/Real Madrid.
One game. vs. Barca or Madrid…
Either United or Chelsea are good enough to win a one-off match. A bad call, a fluke goal, a sending off… and the match is completely changed.
I like Barcelona’s chances against anyone left in the CL as well.
But in a one game Final, United could easily take them down.
Frimpong made his return to the team on the bench for the reserve match against Sunderland. 4-2 win for the Red and White.
Saw the RM v Spurs match – even at 11 men I thought Spurs would have a tough time. The first 5 minutes was down in the Spurs end right up until the goal.
Starting Bale on the right hurt them too. I guess even Super ‘Arry gets it wrong. Bale didn’t really pose a threat until he switched back to the left. But he kept coming in and out of the game. He didn’t look fit except for 1 or 2 good runs.
I still dislike Adebuywhore, but after that performance yesterday I’d likely forgive and forget if he could do that for us.
Shalke wow. That is all I got to say. Either Inter really really suck or Schalke is the real deal.
@DaAdminGooner, ade the dade!
@DaAdminGooner, ade the dade! good for him. he makes those headers look so easy. bendtner and chamakh should take notes. one adebayor is better than chamakh and bendtner combined. really hated to see him forced out of arsenal that way. once again, good for him.
Both Inter and Totteringham get EMBARRASSED in the Champions League!
Its down to rooting for other teams you don’t like to lose!
Because there is no hope for Arsenal, and we aren’t in the CL anymore.
Woe is us.
But Inter get rolled against AC Milan in a massive match, and then get thumped at home in the CL. Mr. Big Game Eto does FUCK ALL in either match… LOVE IT.
Tottenham. Oh Tottenham.
Just a brilliant display. No chance to advance. They can say they went further than Arsenal, but that’s about it. They might not qualify for the CL again for another 4 or 5 years!
;)
@stag133,
Aha, when you concede 5 goals at home, not even a combination of Ronaldo, Pele and Maradona can save you. The loss of Lucio and Samuel has completely gutted them.
Holy Schalke Batman, Inter are in a jam!!
@Sachin,
Yeah, what a fucking job by Schalke. Fell behind twice in the first half- on the road- to the defending European champs. And they win 5-2. They could lose the next one 3-0 and still advance. Maybe I’m wrong to think the winner of Chelsea-ManUre will demolish them….
And now crouch is off with 2 stupid, stupid bookings in the first 16 minutes.
@ChicagoGooner, Heavy brain farting by the tall fella….and about 1000 times more deserving of a sending off than RVPs…..Still can’t believe that the Swiss fellow will be reffing the final….
@highburyterracesteve,
Well the final is 95% likely to be Spain vs. England now, so hopefully he will have the same Spanish affinity and English aversion as he did in our game.
Watching the Spuds match at the Bernebeu… who else but Adebayor to head one in against them in the 4th minute?
Been on the move for the past several days AND depressed by the latest non-result, hence no posting for me. I watched the match down in San Francisco, at the pub, with the Bay Area Gooners and it was awfully sad….40 or 50 fans all craving the big release that an Arsenal goal would have caused, yet having to stifle it….
So, I’ve read through all the articles and posts I missed while I was gone and I have to say that I agree with much that the regulars are saying. (Welcome to the new posters, as always, and I appreciate the good writing and interesting perspective of 15yogooner. Troubled times, indeed….)
While I went to see Saturday’s match with my usual hope I felt my heart drop when I saw Cesc starting on the bench. We looked bright early but the match turned, IMO, when Clichy put in the hospital ball to Nasri. He went up gamely but the welt on his head was emblematic of all that is wrong with the current squad.
How many headed goals has Nasri scored (ever)? The pass showed how bereft of ideas our left back, and the team in general, is. The show of effort by Nasri (Arshavin might’ve put his hands to hips and stood there….) was just that: a show, but the resulting lump wasn’t. That’s what you get when players are asked to do things that aren’t to their strengths: half-hearted efforts and stupid injuries. Lofted crosses might be alright with Chamakh or Bendtner in there, but with RVP, Nasri and Arsh, please, for god’s sakes, play it in low…..
I’m sorry but I have to agree with the Freds, Vibes, Stags and Mazzas, et. al. that there is little in the way of strategic or tactical planning on show and it’s groundhog day all over again….. It’s as if, surprise–surprise, nobody thought for a second that Blackburn might be happy to sit back and play defense. And the subs? Please….After the headbutt, Nasri staggered around but was still more effective than Alex Song, whose every limp and pass and blundering tackle seemed a plea for replacement.
And we still had a chance with the (ridiculous) sending off and the fact that (amazingly) our death row inmate (Almunia) hadn’t gifted Blackburn a goal….Unfortunately we chose to finish the match with 9, Song being done and Cesc needing crutches or a wheelchair….
Moving on from the match itself, the team, to a man, starting with the manager, needs to look in the mirror, get down upon his knees and grovel for respect. Having come this far, and not doing so yet, frankly, I don’t see it happening. Blackpool away, Liverpool at home, then Bolton and Spurs away. Without a major turnaround in those (difficult) matches, ManUnited could very well claim the title on our pitch! And in the end, maybe it would be fitting…..
Finally, as for the topic at hand (Wenger’s future at the club)…. Sometimes, when I wake up and turn on the computer and wait for it to load before checking the overnight football news, I wonder what reaction I would have if I were to read about AW stepping down (he will not be sacked) and I realize it would be one of real excitement about a new direction for the club. I still stand by the idea that his efforts have put us on a solid (financial) footing for the future, AND that he has (on a disciplined budget) unearthed some solid talents and kept us “competitive’. Something else, however, seems needed to get us over the hump and I’m getting awfully tired of waiting for it to just happen…..The current moment seems as good a time as any for the boost or shake-up, of almost any sort, that seems desperately required…..
Come Sunday, I’ll still be hopeful, but for the moment at least, I worry that my prediction of less than 15 points (from the final 30) may be the (very, very ugly) eventuality…..
This comment of mine probably has no relevance to this story, but I am a big rugby supporter just as I am a football lover…that said I support the Bulls (a rugby union team) in South Africa, during the 80’s the Bulls were untouchable but then came the darkest era of our lives the 90’s we lost everything, players, games, you name it. super 12 had just started, playing against the best of Australia and New Zealand, we got hammered, lost every single game, even getting scores such as 50 – 0 against us…..but then one day a certain Heyneke Meyer walked in, got a structure going, invested in the right players, used his youth academy to full potential and since then the Bulls has never looked back, 3 times Super rugby champions, 6 times currie cup champions in the ten years from 2000, 90’s – nothing!…..back to what this article is, I know that comment meant nothing but to those will actually find the morale on the story, never give up hope! As for Wenger, he needs to be more clinical in his decision making, or else like they say a new broom always sweeps clean!
You’re entitled to your opinion – and the article was very nicely written.
If you’re happy with keeping up with the leaders before the final straight every season, only to collapse like a lame horse – like clockwork – around same time of year – then by all means carry on supporting the current regime. You should continue to see some good football, especially if Ramsay comes back to a good level and combines with Wilshere.
BUT – as I said three or four years ago – as long Denilson, Diaby, Song, Clichy, (and now that disgrace Chamakh can be added to the list), then you’ll continue to see the same old pattern for the next five years, with this season being the best case scenario – being second and ahead of Chelsea and City. That’s as good as it will get. And make no mistake, those same players will continue to be in our squad for whoever long Wenger is in charge, because again, without sounding sickenly smug about myself, I also said three years ago that Wenger will want to keep at least four or five members from the 06/07 Carling Cup final so he can pretend that that squad that he hailed as “future dominators” after losing to Chelsea, played some sort of significant role in our success and so he can claim he was right all along. Do you remember Wenger’s comments about that side dominating the league in a couple of years? Nope? Some people have strange memories eh? ;) (although in fairness you were about 11)
So discard any bullshit press statements about how he’s losing faith in certain squad members, because he says the same shit every season and by the summer he’s back to reeling off the same old rhetoric about how much we’ve improved.
I can’t stand the man. I make no apologies about that. The day he leaves will be the day we can get our real Arsenal back, hopefully.
Excellent article. I’m getting sick of the “no trophies in 6 years so manager bad, fire manager, ugg ugg” group. There are other factors to consider. For a start what makes you think that by far the greatest manager that the club has ever had will be replaced by someone better. You are all delusional if you believe that not to say sickeningly ungrateful in the way that you all ridicule a man that has done so much for the club.
@Charlie, you’re right. let’s do NOTHING, and give him and all the players a big raise.
and the club can just increase the HIGHEST PRICES in Europe to pay for the raises.
and we’re delusional?
really?
@Charlie,
George Graham was replaced by a guy whose previous best work was in Japan.
No one is irreplaceable and you never know where the next great Manager will come from.
@Charlie,
Hahaha … first, Wenger is NOT the greatest manager Arsenal has ever had. Except you are also 15 years old you must have heard of Chapman and Graham.
And please, spare us the “without Wenger, Arsenal is doomed” nonsense. Get it into your head that Wenger is NOT Arsenal.
I repeat, Wenger is NOT Arsenal.
You AKB lot are like battered housewives suffering from Stockholm Syndrome.
Black eye, broken nose, pushed down stairs, but you will still swear to your friends that you “walked into a door” and that “he loves me, and you guys just dont understand him …”.
Wake up.
Wenger should go! No competent coach would sit around for six years without delivering any trophies and then have the audacity to complain about the fixture schedule. That is what I call the audacity of mediocrity. This man has run out of ideas. As mourinho right said, he is a Loser.
Ummmm.
More BS from Arsene.
He is now using the “schedule” as his built in excuse for the remaining games.
We have 8 remaining games, and 7 are on SUNDAY, one on a Wednesday.
He says that’s not fair. We can’t exert pressure on ManU if our games are on Sunday.
Boo-freaking-Hoo.
Maybe if we just WIN a damned match, it might make a difference.
WengerSpeak and his excuses are just TIRED and OLD.
The club is NOT going in the right direction on the pitch. That is very much evident.
The manager, Lord Arsene… hasn’t produced a winner in 6 YEARS…
sorry, that is simply not good enough…
He has lost HIS team… they don’t play with passion… or determination… currently they waltz around the park without a care in the world.
Wenger did a great job when he came to the club… but his time has long since past here… perhaps Dein leaving was THE problem, he has no one to answer to… no threat to losing his job.
and … he relays the same thing to his players, who play as if there is no threat to their jobs… and are paid handsomely … regardless.
It will be a very very difficult off-season, with Cesc going… and likely nobody of any note coming in, unless Wenger leaves the club, and there is new blood and a new attitude instilled.
The Arsenal FC need a blood transusion.
And.
It starts with Arsene Wenger leaving. Something has to change, and nothing will with Wenger leading this club as currently constituted.
A sad ending to a legend. But all good things must end.
He is NOT the club. He is NOT bigger than the club. And the club will go on after he leaves…
@stag133,
I truly hate to say this, but maybe we need Jerry Jones to buy the club. He recognized Landry was past his sell-by date and cut him loose with no mercy. And, of course, no class.
Okay, we’re not that desperate.
@vibe4arsenal, Look. I don’t need him fired without class or mercy. We can have a big send-off for him, maybe move him upstairs into a different position in the club. But its obvious he has LOST THE TEAM on the field. They are … and have been playing… like they do NOT have a care in the world, despite every match since the first Barcelona match being MASSIVELY IMPORTANT.
walking in the park… that’s what I see from the players.
@stag133,
I thought it was obvious I was kidding about the Jimmy Johnson/Landry analogy. Guess that’s why they make emoticons.
When he’s gone, he needs to be GONE. His legacy, presence and ego would be too great to have him hanging over the head of whomever replaces him.
Have a nice party, name a luxury box in his honor and wish him well wherever he goes next.
@stag133,
Actually it was Jerry Jones who gave Landry the boot… and then brought in JJ to replace him. (The two were teammates on the Arkansas Razorbacks.) And you know what… JJ went on to coach the Cowboys to two Super Bowls. No Cowboys fans would disagree that Landry is their greatest-ever coach, but the same people would also agree in retrospect that it was time to let him go, even if they didn’t agree at the time. Just b/c he was brilliant in the past doesn’t mean he was the best option for the future.
Very good read; especially on the goal keeping. Of course you can’t compare our squad to the invincibles, but it is rare to find find ANY squad comparable to them. Bad fortune happens…and it has happened this season…b/c of Arsenal players and in spite of Arsenal players…Most notably the meltdown at St. James’s park. Gooner till I die.
The only AKB blog I bother reading is Arseblog, and thats mostly because I have been reading it since 2001.
And even he is starting to feel the painful smack of reality.
He says:
“In the second, when it became obvious we needed to change things the manager’s substitutions were odd. I thought Arshavin had a decent first half but struggled at the beginning of the second. Yes, we needed to bring Cesc on but why not leave Arshavin and take off Alex Song who was clearly having problems? He picked up a knock and was limping around the place. It wasn’t even as if he was that vital yesterday. Blackburn barely threatened, when they did it was because Almunia’s chocolate wrists tried to gift them, and we could have kept the Russian on.”
Haha, it seems he is finally figuring out that Wenger is pretty much an inflexible, tactical ape.
—————-
“It was interesting on the walk back to the pub to listen to the amount of people who think the manager’s time is up. I spoke to people afterwards who had to deal with Arsenal fans fighting each other in their section. Physically scrapping over what they’d seen on the pitch. If that doesn’t tell you something’s badly wrong then I don’t know what would.”
Wow, the REVOLUTION is starting my friends! Quietly, slowly but surely.
To the kid who wrote the post, nothing personal, but I don’t think there is any insight to be gleaned from a 15 year old kid. Especially one that just parrots several thoroughly debunked AKB falsehoods. Sorry.
That said, I give you full credit for excellent grammar, punctuation and thought process flow.
@Fred,
While his view point is certainly shorter than most of ours it is no less relevant – and if you see I did ask for someone to do the view point on why Wenger should stay.
You wouldn’t agree with anyone on that point Fred.
@Fred,
While I disagree with the content of the post, it’s hard to dismiss his opinion based on age alone. There’s plenty of adults who parrot the same stuff, without the excuse of having such a narrow frame of reference. Many of them, including some on here, don’t even write as well. Or sound as mature.
My guess is 15yoGooner will learn before they do.
@wankerwengermustgo,i wonder if guys like u will ever get it. The writer asked if there re managers that will do wat wenger has done with the situation at the club? You must be a joke to call mourinho. He is no manager but a mercenary. Can arsenal pay him 20mil a yr and give him 150mil for transfers? Yes but we must be prepared to play in the championship. Its obvious that wenger came up with the youth policy after we left highbury but u guys read junks from biased sites about arsene being shrewd and then chant along. Its a shame.
@ WANKERWENGERMUTGO..SPOT ON!..and btw it was me that made that statement in the other blog…lets hope the powers that be read our comments
Well young man …. you are in a minority of 1 I think. Do you think that if we had say Murhinio as Manager, … all we would have ended up with year in and year out – for 6 whole seasons – is an outing in the Champions League?? Do you think that a manager like Murihino would have settled for that sort of stats and tried to spin adulation on himself for producing jack shit?! Top flight Managers like Murinhino would have left a long time ago of his own free will in shame. Thats what you call a quality Manager.
Arsene Wenger is a spin doctor. He is no super class manager. Someone in another blog said that if ever there was a manager who happened to be in the right place at the right time – it is Wenger! Absolutely.
@wankerwengermutgo,
Would Mourinho have set up the future of our club so well? It’s not only about the present, it’s about the future too. If it had been Mourinho he would have spent money on 27/28 year olds for only a couple of years’ service in their prime, soon they’d be average and be offloaded (think Ballack, huge wages too) and Mourinho would have disregarded the youth system. After we’d won something, maybe two years on, Mourinho would leave and we’d be in trouble. IMO.
Thanks for the constructive comments and opinions folks.
There are plenty of managers who are better coaches than Wenger. Here is a list of possible replacements:
Mourinho, Rjikaard,Moyes, Klinsmann. Wenger is an average coach and should go. He will never deliver a trophy to the Arsenal. This joke of a coach should go back to Japan or France!
@wankerwengermutgo,
“Top flight Managers like Murinhino would have left a long time ago of his own free will in shame. Thats what you call a quality Manager. ”
Lol… Funny how Mourinho isnt a bottler for leaving after losing but a quality manager. Now only if players condense that feeling in a 90 minute microcosm you’d say they have no fight. You want them to fight till the last but when another manager is willing to fight it out ….
the grass is always greener on the other side.
@wankerwengermutgo,
“Top flight Managers like Murinhino would have left a long time ago of his own free will in shame. Thats what you call a quality Manager. ”
Lol… Funny how Mourinho isnt a bottler for leaving after losing but a quality manager. Now only if players condense that feeling in a 90 minute microcosm you’d say they have no fight. You want them to fight till the last but when another manager is willing to fight it out ….
the grass is always greener on the other side.
Martin Keown as I mentioned believes Wenger will blow up the youth policy if they go without winning silverware this season.
The Telegraphy suggests today that even Wenger is losing faith in the youth of the team:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/premier-league/8425703/Has-Arsenal-manager-Arsene-Wenger-finally-begun-to-lose-faith-in-youngsters-following-Blackburn-Rovers-stalemate.html
I’m a card carrying AKBer (wierd but I don’t know what the acronym itself stands for) and I won’t apologize for it. If you aren’t you can skip this post. This one’s going to be long
What the old timers say.
We’ve had a few members of the invincibles come back to train with this squad and they’ve generally had nothing but good to say about the potential/ability of the present squad. I don’t see a reason why any of them would lie about what they felt about the squad either. Lesson: So ability is not the problem
We are 2nd in the league. Go figure!
Yes, we are. Wierd thing is, I had a dream yesterday nite that Chelsea was 2nd and we were 3rd in the league. And it sure as hell may happen or maybe my subconscious is telling me what I really believe. But until then, and with 9 games (or thereabout to go), we are 2nd in a marathon of 38 games with more than a 3rd gone. We also have the outside chance of actually coming first. I’d assume that to get to such a position you need a little bit of ability or fight. Lesson: once again, ability is not the problem
On the other hand, who in this team will make it into Chelsea’s first team
Say it with me – 1. Okay, that’s a subjective answer, but I think only RVP in the squads we’ve been playing lately will make it into a first team. Now this may sound like blasphemy but I think the same was the case with the invincibles. Only, perhaps, Viera and DB10 (yes, no TH14) would have been able to walk into any of the top teams in their era at their peak. Lesson: Arsenal, under Wenger, has always been an unbelievably unique experience and never really so much about normalcy. Put another way, Arsene has, quite frankly, always been exceptional given his squads
So let’s get realistic (lemme play Stag)
No disrespect Stag, I could have chosen a dozen more names but you strike me as the bell ringer of the non-AKBers. And that in a subtle way is a complement ;)
Ok, seriously, there’s something wrong with this team. I know it. You know it. Arsene knows it. 5 years ago I knew it would take about 5 years for a team of 19/20 year olds to grow into winning the league. That expectation was almost cut shut when Hleb (I liked him, you know) and Flamini ably aided by the Dade and a few others almost pulled that one season wonder. You see, all the greatest teams, generally have a generous number of 26/25 year olds and not 19/20 year old boy wonders. But now, 5 years on, Clichy/Sagna/Cesc/Song/RVP/Verminator/Kos all at about their best years, we are still bottling games and losing battles. Something is wrong with this team alright. We may not all agree on what exactly it is – injuries, bottle (notice how that word can be used positively or negatively?), hard work, determination, technical ability, character (Arsene’s favorite?), drive, coaching inneptitude. Lesson is something is wrong with the team. We may differ on what’s wrong but something is not yet right with this team
Is this Barca or it is Arsenal
One of the problems with supporting Arsenal is understanding the club’s philosophy on and off the pitch. Arsenal is not Barca-lite. Their attacking philosophies are only similar so far as it pertains to one-dimensionality of their ball retention and passing. Barca’s will not work in the EPL. They’ll be a top 5 team with 3/4 of their players croked 4/5 of the time in the EPL. Arsenal will be a top 5 team in La Liga with far less of their players hurt. Where Barca play short passes with a generous sprinkling individual dribbling. Arsenal plays (or strives to play) complete team football with… side-ways passes at top speed :). In defense, it’s the exact opposite. Barca defend as a team whereas we leave Kos/Squill/Gael to continually embarrass themselves at the least provocation.
Ok, there’s no lesson here. I just felt I should rant a little
So what’s the point?
Arsenal is not going to change till the end of the season. What we’ve got is what we’ve got. Coming back here over and over again to tell me you were right at the start of the season when the season has not ended is… pointless – especially considering that nothing’s going to change for worse from now till the end of the season (it can’t get worse than not making top 4, right?). If anything, there’s a slight chance now with support and encouragement whatever little character is left in this team might just manifest (now you know why I’m a card carrying AKBer). I’m not saying don’t rant after a game that feels like a waste of 90 minutes. I even recommend you rant, curse and puff. But don’t do it continually when there’s that small chance that you could impact the team positively.
Here’s the thing. The reason we are Arsenal fans (especially the < 30 year-old lot of us that started following the team under Wenger's era) is that he managed to bring out the AKB in us. With a teams that, individually, aren't the best, he has always managed to do the phenominal. That's why I support this team. Kanu, Edu, Wiltord, Gilberto, Parlor, Adams e.t.c. were not complete players but achieved what they did within the confines of the Arsenal philosophy. It was a team that dared to believe. And believing, it dared to achieve. And boy, did it achieve some awesome stuff. We still see that potential to achieve in this team. Yes, something is missing, but you know that’s the beauty of been an AKB – it’s almost like this project is ours (regardless of the parts we are more than willing to ditch – Denilson, anybody?).
Lesson: Liverpool fans sing you’ll never walk alone even when everybody know their team sucks