The Stuff Dreams Are Made Of. Arsenal v Barcelona (CL QF 1st Leg)
It's Show Time
When I set out to write this preview, I thought about going down the path I usually do with these kind of things and outline the run up to the match and how it will play out. But as I look at this matchup between Arsenal and Barcelona, I can’t help but be amazed at the treat football fans are in for.
If this match plays out as we think it should, then fans of the beautiful game, even neutrals, are in store for an absolute cracker of a match. really, if you are about free flowing, passing, and attacking football then the gathering of these two teams Wednesday at the Emirates and next week at the Nou Camp is the pinnacle of what you want to see.
One on side you have the current “it” team – Barcelona. This is a team you don’t hate on. It has so much talent you wonder how long their run of success will go on. They currently boast their own creative 22 year old maestro, Lionel Messi. As has been said repeatedly over the last few weeks there aren’t enough adjectives to describe how good he is. In England the attempts to compare him to Wayne Rooney are clumsy at best. Rooney while he as the strength just does not have the creativity nor skill that Messi has.
But Messi is not their only weapon and Arsenal fans would be remiss to think so. They have their own Toure, Xavi, Pique and Zlatan Ibrahimavic. Throw in an Arsenal legend for good measure and you have a team that is absolutely a joy to watch play.
On the other side you have the heir apparent to the current “it” squad – Arsenal. My heart is red and white and I really believe we are on the cusp of seeing Arsenal reach the greatness of the same level as this Barca side. Led by the former product of Barca’s famed youth academy – Cesc Fabregas, Arsenal have their own talent crop to showcase. Led in the back by Thomas Vermaelen, Alex Song, Andrei Arshavin, Samir Nasri and Abou Diaby, and others, Arsenal feature some of the best young talent in the EPL. But they are still talent unrealized.
For the first time in five years though, Arsenal are challenging for trophies in the league and on the continent. Their path at home is still rough but they have been one of the more consistent sides (with the exception of that Brum draw) since the end of January. They have matured and maybe have begun to develop the necessary skills to be more competitive in challenging for the title than they have been in recent memory.
Hwever, when you look at this squad, it is a squad built for the continental tournament. It’s focus is less on brut slogging but stylish passing and attacking, controlling the ball and patiently moving it forward looking to dice open an opponent. Much like their opponent does back in La Liga.
There are so many sub-plots to this match and frankly the press has been running with them since the tie was announced. It represents the return of probably the greatest Arsenal player to ever wear the kit – Thierry Henry. Henry comes back amid much emotion at having to face his old club. Something he claims he did not want to do because of the love of the fans. But Henry is class and Arsenal fans will love him regardless of the kit he wears. The roar at the team introductions will be deafening. Pires got it last year and it still rings in his ears. Henry’s cheer will last him the rest of his eternal life.
It also features my choice of Arsene Wenger’s eventual replacement, Pep Guardiola. Pepe in his first season set out and like Arsene claimed trophies. Except he exceeded Arsene’s haul by a few. He took the treble in capturing La Liga, the Spanish Cup and the Champion’s league. Throw in 3 other trophies and in his first year the club won an impressive array of silverware. They are well on their way for more glory and all because this former Barcelona star has his team playing like his team of the 90’s.
The other subplot is Cesc Fabregas playing against the club that formed his talent in the early years. The club that has made no secret of its desire to bring him home. The club that will use him as a pawn in its Presidential elections. The club of his home. It was at Barcelona that Cesc learned of the saying “Mes que un club” – more than a club. It is what is drilled into every Barca youth’s head. But fate had him bring that mantra to Arsenal, where at 16 he was the youngest player eer to start in a first team match. He is in my opinion the best midfield player in the EPL. A feat only enhanced by his growth this season in Arsene’s new formation (a homage to Barca).
There are so many more. We can all discuss and digest. Frankly, I just want to sit back and enjoy what is likely to be the best two legs of the Champion’s League. Don’t you?
Now for the normal stuff.
How the Match Should Play Out:
Arsenal face off of against a squad that in the last two years beat both Chelsea and United – two teams that have had their way with Arsenal this season. You could argue though that Arsenal are built for just this type of game, where skill, speed, finesse, a ballet of ball movement are needed. It is going to be an open game. Both sides are likely to score multiple times. That all leaves it to who would have the class at Nou Camp.
Probable Starting XI:
Arsenal: Almunia, Vermalen, Campbell, Sagna, Clichy, Song, Diaby, Fabregas, Arshavin, Nasri, Bendtner
Barcelona: Valdes, lves, Puyol, Milito, Maxwell; Toure, Xavi, Messi ; Pedro, Ibrahimovic, Henry
Injuries:
Arsenal: Van Persie (ankle), Gibbs (foot), Djourou (knee) Ramsey (leg)
Barcelona: Pique, Abidal, Iniesta (don’t quote me on these)
Recent League Form:
Arsenal: DWWWW
Barcelona: WDWWW
TV Broadcast:
US: Fox Soccer Channel/Foxsoccer.tv 1445 EST
UK: ITV1
Online Streams:
www.atdhe.net
www.justin.tv
www.iraqgoals.net
www.myp2p.eu
GAMEDAY CHAT Will Be On: www.youaremyarsenal.com/gamedaychat
YAMA Prediction:
Arsenal: 2
Barcelona: 2
308 comments
Leave a reply
You must be logged in to post a comment.
On the outside looking in, both sides of the argument make valid points. First, who in their right mind would say that Fabregas isn’t a dynamite player? That would be foolish. It would be equally foolish to compare a 23 year old to Baggio, Bergkamp, or Mostovoi. It’s too early in Cesc’s career.
In my opinion, the disconnect is a tactical one. Baggio, Bergkamp, etc, were proper #10s; forwards who made everyone around them look good. Fab isn’t a forward. Neither is Fab a dribbler like Kaka or Gerrard. He’s a creative midfielder like Xavi or Rui Costa. The problem is Wenger seems determined to make Cesc a #10 and push him further forward. For most of us, Fabregas is clearly at his best from deep with another attacking, penatrive dribbling player in front of him. This is where Mazza’s Hleb argument becomes legitimate.
Stats wise, Fab has had his best year. He’s a talented player who’s still developing so that’s quite natural. But imagine how much more effective he would be with a Hleb-type presence in front of him. He certainly wouldn’t get kicked as much and would have more time on the ball. Xavi has Messi in front of him which gives him time and space. If that fails, he could just shift to Iniesta. Rui Costa had Figo in front of him running at defenders. At Milan, he had Kaka, Seedorf, and Rivaldo in front of him. The difference is Arsenal’s creative onus is all placed on Fab’s 23 year old shoulders and he really doesn’t have much help. Everyone we play knows he’s the guy and that’s why he gets kicked so much. Ungood.
Arshavin’s been descent at times. Likewise has Nasri. But the reality is with Hleb gone, van Persie injured, and Rosicky no longer being a regular, Fab no longer has a go-to guy on the team he can pass the ball to and count on to make a play. It’s all on him and while it’s cool as a young player being the hero, sometimes it can also be disenchanting.
Great talk all around about our captain…kinda makes me sad he’s out for the rest of the season….
I have to agree with Fred regarding Cesc. I can’t imagine any Gooner asking for anything more of our 22-year-old Captain from either a playing perspective or a leadership perspective. He is gifted, loyal, and utterly committed, as we saw in Wednesday’s game.
To those who feel that our team plays “pretty shite football,” I would say please keep things in perspective. We are third in the EPL table 4 points behind the leader and 10 points above the fourth place team having scored 74 goals in 32 games. We are also in the quarterfinals of the CL for the umpteenth time. Some people might argue that our standing is down to luck, weak competition, etc., but I believe that the consistency of our results does not lie. We are a pretty darn good team.
The real issue is that, at the moment, we are not quite good enough to overtake ManU and Chelsea. I would agree that we are not ready to challenge them, but where others are exasperated I am excited. The real truth of the matter is that this team still has not yet reached maturity. We are still too young. However, with a couple more years of growth and one or two more Vermaelen-class signings this team will be the class of Europe (lead by the indomitable Cesc who is not going anywhere). In two + years most of our boys will just be entering their prime:
Cesc 24
Vermaelen 26
Diaby 25
Nasri 24
Merida 22
Bendtner 24
Ramsey 21
Sagna 29
Song 24
Walcott 22
Van Persie 28
I know many Gooners are upset having had to endure a prolonged (relatively speaking) period of retooling; however, for several reasons that was always the way it was going to work for us. I know I am not in the majority on this site, but I firmly believe Arsene has laid the foundation for another very special team, and fortunately he has the patience and the board support to see it through.
AMEN.
In the long-term, we are exactly where we want to be, and Wenger has succeeded again in doing what is asked of him, and his team.
No, we aren’t as good as Chelsea / United / or Barcelona head to head. (thought the Barca match Tuesday might determine that!)
But… we aren’t really trying to worry about that, we’re playing by different rules… with financial limits, and with profit and long-term stability in mind.
Fred you’re doing your thing again when you ignore what your eyes tell you and go back to the stats thing ;)
As you said above yourself, Fabregas will be not missed next week. Why do you say that? Because you’ve obviously realised he’s not really playing well at this point and neither are the team. Yes, there are glaring holes in the side, but it’s still possible to notice trends within our play when Fabregas is playing number 10.
The trend I’m seeing is that we play pretty shit football for a team heralded as the Harlem Globetrotters in some circles. It’s almost becoming a battle between productivity and having a cohesive unit. Against lesser sides the overall ‘flow’ of the side is not as important because we have the individuals(like Cesc) to score goals at appropriate times, however against the top teams our individual talent gets snuffed out alot easier and in such a situations our weaknesses as an overall dynamic are laid bare for all to see, and those are not all of a defensive nature. Our attacking game is very ad hoc when our balloon of momentum/basic belief is punctured.
Fabregas is a great player, but his role in the team needs tinkering at times, especially against the big sides. I’m not sure how many times we need to get shown up as both a OFFENSIVE and defensive force, for people to acknowledge this.
Mazza your’re “doing your thing again”. You wait for a bad performance and then you rush to tell us how shit we really are as a football team.
Mazza, all teams have bad periods within a season. Look at billion dollar Chelsea for example not so impressive at times right? We lost the striker that made us tick in our newish system, 4-3-3. Prior to that our dynamic was good. Have you forgotten how we outplayed ManU at OT. Except for poor decision making from Manny and Diaby we would have won that game. I will also remind you in the PL last season we had the 2nd best record in the “top four league” losing only one game and beating both ManU and Chelsea. We had a weaker squad than we do now.
We are good enough to beat the top teams including Barca on a good day just as much as they are able to beat us.
Our tactics and defensive frailty needs to be addressed, no doubt. But when you say “Our attacking game is very ad hoc when our balloon of momentum/basic belief is punctured,” I ask and who’s isn’t? Every team attacks well when they are confident and have gained rather than lost momentum.
“Fabregas is a great player” so you no longer call him “average” I respect that. But “but his role in the team needs tinkering at times, especially against the big sides. I’m not sure how many times we need to get shown up as both a OFFENSIVE and defensive force, for people to acknowledge this.” That seems to suggest Fabregas’ is the problem. Tinkering with the roles within theteam, yes, we need to do something. That is a holistic solution, but Fabregas’ role in and of itself is never going to make or break us, let’s not put all ouur problems on the lads shoulders or make him a scapegoat (not suggesting that you are though).
Agree completely.
Mazza, u are so full of bullocks sometimes you are incredible.
You were the one trying to claim Arsenal never played attractive football before Hleb and wouldnt after… LOL!
First of all, ONLY DIABY can be called “incredible”… the word defines him.
@ Mazza, I don’t think we’re ordinary, though Barcelona are in another level… and United and Chelsea showed head to head that we’re no match either.
BUT… it is about the 38 game league schedule, and how you fare against everyone over the marathon.
Give Wenger props and the team props for remaining in the league title hunt until the end, and in the CL with a shout.
Did you expect THIS team to WIN the league or WIN the CL?
No, not really… so Wenger and the team have over-acheived… filled the stadium, made a profit, played a good style, and competed hard all season long…
younger players got big time experienced, some players have developed, and we did it all on a budget that no other “big” team enforces.
@ Arthur… what tactics are wrong?
what defensive issues do you want addressed? (that you see Wenger believing there is a problem with)
If he thinks Almunia will continue to develop and be our No.1, gotta go with Arsene over YOU… and there isn’t any other spot defensively he’ll feel we need to address …
Stop Wenger Bashing … he isn’t going anywhere, and he is doing EXACTLY what is wanted and expected by the club, keeping us in the battle to the very end.
So True :-D
@ Vibe, Andez:
You keep on talking about consistency, “a great leader who consistently brings out the best in others”, etc. Can you name just ONE attacking midfielder in the last twenty years that beats Fabregas for consistency. Gerrard? Nope, Kaka and Zidane were never consistently great. Infact Zidane was a lazy bum who was invinsible for 70 minutes of most games. Who else, Baggio? Diego? Litmanen?
Mention ONE AM that embodies that combines the assists, goals and overall creativity. There was even the suggestion that someone a bit better should be brought in to relieve pressure…. but WHO is consistently better than him in his position??
The only people that come to my mind are Iniesta and Xavi … I watch a lot of Barca games and I can assure you they are NOT consistent. Secondly, they CAN NOT survive the Premiership. NO CHANCE!
Being an AM in the PL is HEAT and PAIN … the tackles come in and the whistle doesnt blow! Iniesta/Xavi cant handle that shit. He is not “a little bit” overrated, because to be overrated there must be a bunch of players who can do what you do better and more consistently. Even in his absolutely shit nights he still produces SEVERAL potential assists, that the strikers usually mess up.
It doesn’t mean he’s not a brilliant footballer. Just that he may not be one of those top 5-10% guys, who are always at their best and a great leader who consistently brings out the best in others.
The guy ALWAYS shoots down transfer rumors, he always keeps a cool head in all those last minute penalties, top assist man in whole of Europe for several seasons running, top scorer for Arsenal, changed SEVERAL crucial games, even cries like a baby after scoring some of those crucial goals…. what more do you want from him???
Fred, I respect the hell out of your football knowledge. And I only watch the Prem regularly, so I won’t even try to touch you when it comes to scouting other players/other leagues.
But you’re picking and choosing parts, which I guess is natural, but context counts.
I could care less what any other AMs today, yesterday, or tomorrow do/did/will do. When I evaluate Fab’s consistency it relates to AFC and how our side is currently constructed. Yeah, maybe if we had strikers who could consistently turn those passes on those off days (and don’t even mention RVP here), his level of inconsistency wouldn’t rate comment. But we don’t, so it does.
If you wanna say that ‘overrate’ is the wrong word, okay. Probably you’re right. As I really think about what I mean, it’s that we won’t win anything with him as the best player on our team.
He consistently shoots down transfer rumors? You consistently make better points than that, so… ;-)
What better players? Kaka? Ronaldo? Rooney? Xavi? Are you expecting us to buy those players?
The team not winning has NOTHING to do with Fabregas, it has everything to do with Wenger and his allowing MASSIVE holes to appear all over the team.
The goalkeeper, CB and DM positions are critical positions that should be sorted out with STRONG, competent 25 year olds.
Its as if you guys are disappointed Fabregas isnt some extraterrestial beast, single-handedly BALANCING out the MAJOR structural defects the current Arsenal team has. There is only so much ONE guy can do for you. Maradona, Pele, Ronaldo, etc in their primes cant save a team that has major structural defects.
What you guys are seeking is some dude who will do a “Maradona” but on a regular basis and pretty much “consistently” and literally drag Arsenal to victory. In other words you are looking for the greatest player of all times!
And since he cant do that you figure he is a “bit overrated”.
You know I agree about Wenger, CB, DM and GK. You’re evaluating Fabregas against all other AM’s, ever. I’m talking about within our current structure. It really is two different conversations.
How would an ‘extraterrestrial beast’ fit into the whole 6-5 plan? I guess it’s a legal vs. illegal alien thing? Anyway, I’m open to such signing.
We’ll have to wait until the summer to see how this season has influenced our manager’s perception of our roster depth.
No, we won’t.
it will have no effect at all.
FANTASTIC SEASON for Arsenal FC, PLC Unlimited.
Sold out every match, in the league fight until the end, and the same with the CL, didn’t spend much money in the off-season/January… made huge profits.
This is/was an EXCELLENT season for Arsenal and Wenger all around, it is exactly what they want from the team… there would be no reason to change what we are doing whatsoever.
I think Fred’ evaluation of Fab alongside other attacking MFs is valid as it helps to bring things into perspective.
It shows there is no shame in having Fab as our best player as there is not that much better out there.
It is not who is the best player in the current structure but rather how good the “supporting” players are that’s crucial. Cesc has some very good players alongside him. RvP, Song, Arshavin, Nasri, Rosicky etc. All players of undoubted quality.
As already mentioned we have lacked in key areas this season. GK obviously, DM cover could have been a bit better with due respect to the illegitimate one and Diaby. And CF cover also proved lacking as none of our back up strikers have stepped up to the plate RvP left behind.
Not sure what you more you want or expect from the team… and Wenger.
Solidly in 3rd, with a chance to win the league, a chance to take Barcelona in the CL quarterfinals, and if not for injuries and bad refereeing, we might be in FIRST, (and we still have a chance to win the league)… and we MADE profit, didn’t push kids down the pecking order… what should Wenger have done differently?
I don’t think he’d agree that he make ANY mistake in the roster at all.
We are EXACTLY where he wanted us to be…
I think your expectations are a bit out of whack if you expected more??
what more?
It’s been another GREAT season for Arsenal FC.
Played a good style of football too…
Agreed :-D
Zidane was a lazy bum, and Barcelona couldn’t survive the English Prem.
Pure Genius.
So, you are saying the ENTIRE La Liga is utter SHIT.
They and Madrid are 21 points up on the rest of the league.
Yet, this same team, on the road at the Emirates… absolutely abused us for 70 minutes of football.
What does this say about Arsenal and La Liga.
You can’t make a point without throwing in gibberish and rubbish.
sometimes I think people are over sensitive.
On the Cesc topic. Mazza hardly written him off, he just pointed out something that he could do better. Like stamping his authority more in big games.
While myself only suggested he is “A BIT” overrated.
Not like neither of us was saying he is useless.
As for Denilson, I never said he will be as good as Fabregas. My whole point was talking about the ‘FREE ROLE” Cesc’s having that allowed him to have a great season. And pointing out a few of our other players in the team, if given that role, would also be able to play BETTER.
I quote what i wrote here:
“On the other hand, if you give Denilson the freerole, the freedom to roam around, instead of trying to do the holding job, to play with discipline… I bet, though he may not be as good as Cesc, we would be seeing a far more better Denilson than we are right now.”
Did I ever suggest Denilson will be BETTER than Cesc?
Opinion is not about either a player is GREAT, or he is USELESS. No one is perfect, and every player has room to improve. Denilson has room to improve. So does Fabregas. Dont’ just look at the name and number on the back of the players and decide who’s good who’s bad.
Number 4 can make some lazy mis placed pass and no one points that out.
Number 15 if he completed 49 out of 50 passes while missing one he’s uesless.
That is not opinion. That is bias.
Why talk about Denilson in the AM position at all??? He is NOT an AM … and he would suck major balls as an AM.
There is nothing fascinating about completing 49 out of 50 sideways passes if he cant even do the job of a DM. I can do that if given a chance.
Just by making the analogy that Denilson would look good at AM you are majorly underestimating what Fabregas actually does.
If you think the AM position is a “safe, easy” position that any clown can do then you dont really have a clue.
The central AM position is by FAR the most difficult position in ANY team.
Why talk about Denilson in the AM position at all???
——————-
Read my original post. It’s not even about Denilson.
But I guess you are way too sensitive towards this name and just have to make a meal out of it whenever someone mentioned it. I mentioned Arshavin too, why not talking about him?
All the things you moan about Denilson I’ve read probably hundred times the past 2 years. so save it.
Tell me something new.
Tell you something new?? I am attacking your denigration of captain Fab … you should tell me something sensible.
‘Dez please don’t defend Mazza the Monger can defend himself ;-)
Sometime you need to read behind the lines. Mazza has for some strange reason raised his battle axe against Cesc. He said Cesc is average and implied he relies on Hleb to be successful. Now that Cesc has proven he is a star on his own merit Mazza while having to acknowledge the obvious success is trying to find fault and make unachieveable demands. Who really expects Cesc to display “physical power” though.
As for “stamping his authority more in big games”.
Read that again? and tell me what that actually means. “Stamp his authority”? As a player or as a captain? I have always said that I do not think Cesc would make a great captain, he needs someone to lead and pick him up he is still young and not as mentally strong as some of the more experienced players. However I think he has done a better job as captain than I would have thought.
As a player stamping his authority in a physical manner ala Vieira is not his role or what should be expected from him. He is not that type of player. No one can doubt his heart, he is always up for a fight and a scrap but he is not an enforcer or hard man. The only way players like Cesc stamp their authority on a game is by performing well, making key passes, assists and scoring goals, he does just that. It is wrong for Mazza or anyone else to expect much more from him.
Not sure if Mazza will take the bait there, but I’ll chime in….
I’ve been critical of Cesc myself (and my wife won’t stand for it–though she too says that he appears to have had a bit of an “attitude” recently…)
In this season of ridiculous injuries, IMO, Cesc has done what he’s needed to as Captain, and (until now) played through them, showing some inspiring, “take control” moments (Villa home, Stoke away, in particular). It’s been a bit dramatic for my tastes, but there it is…
That said, I think, before the RVP injury, we were playing the best football we had in a very long time and Cesc was a real part of it (quick and long passes and scoring some nice goals himself). We had a pacy, somewhat swaggering style, and but for a couple of (serious) mis-steps in Manchester, there was a chance of really playing teams off the pitch. Of course, that was a while ago, and we’ve been surviving (as best we can) and only against the teams we should be beating anyway, on heart alone (and maybe a little duct tape and baling wire).
As a player, Cesc’s still got a ways to go, but, for me, he showed (a little) improvement in his physical strength, pace and quickness and range of passing (already good). Obviously his finishing improved A LOT but his corners and set-pieces (great goal vs. Villa notwithstanding) still need work. And I agree that this season by looking so aggressively for goals, he has put a lot of defensive pressure and responsibility on his MF mates.
As Captain, the histrionics (playing while hurt…and letting everybody know), pounding his (waxed) chest to show his love for the club, etc., are a bit much, but maybe that’s what the (over-technical, laid back, laconic) team needed. Cesc was also in the ear of the referees, mostly to good effect. Obviously, we need to keep the passion going without him (and get some calls our way), with the first test tomorrow (with a much bigger one on Tuesday).
I’ll look past the former (hoping Wolves “rotate” players as we certainly will) and think about the latter….Rationally, our chances at the Camp Nou are Slim and None, and Slim just left town….(as they say…)
Putting rationality to the side, however, if we can keep them at bay early, and then (somehow) score two quick ones, and then (somehow) they tire trying to score their goals to match us…I like our chances.
Rafa Marquez, Gabriel Milito, Eric Abidal and/or Yaya Toure, (playing ahead of Valdes) or Sol Campbell, TV5 and or Alex Song (with Mooney in goal)?…I’d still say it’s advantage Barca (and something that we need to address in the summer), though neither grouping is particularly inspiring, thus the possibility for a bit of a goal-fest.
Maybe they’ll come out with a defensive line-up and mind-set (nil-nil sees them through, after all, but really I don’t know why they wouldn’t keep the pacy youngsters in). And then our reserves, er, available attackers, put a couple past them, while their (best in the world?) offense spurns their chances (or Mooney has another blinder) and (as Fred suggests) the Camp Nou turns against them. We can dream, can’t we? At least, as Ozi points out, the pay-off is a big one….
@ the Mazza Monger :-P
Yep, this season Cesc has shown you what football fans, professionals and journalists the world over ;-) have known for a long time, he is a quality player with or without Hleb.
I will not refrain from rubbing it in ;-) . Mr “average” as you called him is top draw when he is in form. He has bad days and bad periods throughout a season but like Arshavin he can still produce something special on those bad days.
If you judge Cesc playing at his optimal you can never doubt his ability. You shouldn’t expect him to be at his best throughout a whole season especially as he has had injuries, that is just unrealistic with the amount of games he is expected to play. He is bound to have a bad day here and there especially if the team is not playing well.
Mazza, I do not think anyone expects Cesc to display outstanding “physical power”, if it is indeed physical strength you are referring to. He is no Roy Keane or Patrick Vieira. He is does not need to be either. I have never had to question his physical strength at all, he has always held his own for a relatively small lad. He has great balance and clever feet this compensates for any physical strength he may be lacking.
He is not easily bullied of the ball and he fights for the ball effectively. Cesc has never raised question marks in my eyes unlike Denilson and Theo who both have a propensity to be outmuscled.
To be honest I think you should be apologising for your derision of our great captain instead of trying to cover your embarrassment by sticking out your tongue and saying “i bet you can’t do it for a season though… weakling.” LOL
No seriously, setting the bar higher, to levels higher than 14/15? goals in the PL is unfair. It appears you are setting the bar to a level you know he cannot reach. I am mean he is never gonna a MF “powerhouse” is he? and he may never display the type of form that has got him so many goals throughout the whole season, or he would probably put away 30+ and essentially be injury free.
The first 5 minutes I saw Cesc play as a 16 year old in a Carliing Cup game I said to myself, “He is going to be World Player of the Year some day”.
He has that much talent. It boggles my mind that anyone here could bash on Cesc even when he has an off game or two. He may not win WPOTY, but it would be hard to argue that he is not one of the best players in Europe right now. On top of that he has to shoulder the additional work of carrying some fairly average players, a burden most other top players do not have to contend with. There is much much more to come from him in the years ahead. How many will be in an Arsenal jersey is yet to be determined.
Imagine a team with 6-7 Cesc’s on the team, the football IQ, the determination, ball control and passing skills, etc. Actually no need to imagine, we got to see it on Wednseday night in the first 20 minutes of the game…
JRoy Cesc is a talented player and is way above average. That is my main point, he is top quality and does not depend on other players (i.e Hleb) in order to be an effective player.
I would not say Cesc is one of the best players in Europe right now because to say that would be to put him in the league of Messi, C.Ronaldo, Rooney, Gerrard, Essien, Iniesta. In my opinion Cesc is not that good and I can understand why Andez says Cesc is a little overrated if we use terms like that.
But I suppose if when you say in is one of the best players in Europe you mean best 50/100 then it is a fair comment.
Lie down Arthur, take a deep breath ;)
Maz, I can’t lie down I am enjoying this too much :-P
As someone who has watched 90 minutes of virtually every Barca game in the last decade, am still rather shocked at how everybody and his dog keep yapping on how they would do this or that at the Nou Camp.
This Barca team is SOFT! They wont win jack shit this season. Not the league and not the CL. Anybody who wants to bet on that should contact me!
Everyone keeps talking about them like they are some invincible gods floating around the pitch …. yet a quick re-watching of the match would show that THROUGHOUT the first half, EVERY single time they had the ball, our players moved back and deeper, AWAY FROM THEIR PLAYER!!!
Vermalaen, Sagna and Diaby were having stage-fright, Fabregas was not fit, Gallas was not fit either so Song had to fall deeper. In other words we completely ceded the midfield to them as well as NEVER closing them down on any occasion!
Their defenders and goalie are all clowns. They are pretty much a giant with clay feet. Mark my words, if we get our lineup and basic tactics right next Tuesday we WILL knock them out.
The Nou Camp faithful can be quite intimidating, but that can be put to one’s advantage. Frustrate the team and after 10 minutes the fans will start getting very restive. Once they get restive the team gets more nervous and thats when the mistakes start happening.
PS: I really hope Henry starts that game. The guy is now a pathetic shadow of himself. A very blunt focal point to say the least.
That was the point I was making in game day chat we were not pressing at all giving them space and lots of time to pick their pass, it was pathetic.
Diaby was the biggest culprit and he persisted in the 2nd half.
Stage fright sums it up well we were in awe of them. I was so disappointed with our attitudethat I even quoted Mazza and called us “bottlers”.
Even our rock, the man I think has the strongest mentality apart from Sol maybe, Vermaelen was so in awe of Messi he couldn’t concentrate on his job.
As I wrote in reply to Ozi earlier in the thread: “Ozi he did it twice for both goals. He got drawn out trying to “mark” Messi. That was not his job if it means he has to leave his core central defensive zone. He should have let Messi drift to be marshalled by the MF. For the 1st goal we were defending; the MF and DF were bunched, no space in between DF and MF. The space was in between DF and GK, instead of guarding that space Vermaelen was drawn to Messi who was retreating into the MF area.
Great player but two DF lapses that did not help the cause yesterday.”
Our attitude was all wrong, we were scarced, so it seemed.
I am sure you will agree bar the performaces of Big Al and the illegitimate son with sweet Brazilian ankles we could have got a pasting ;-)
Yes we can beat Barcalona but who is to say we don’t “bottle it again”. We are without 3 of our best players too. It will be difficult.
Yup. Rewatched most of the game again. Vermaelen well caught out of position. Kept Messi quiet but indirectly allowed Ibra 2 goals. He didn’t do that as much in the first half and I wonder whether it may be because of Song moving into CB leaving Vermaelen thinking “oh shit, who the hells gonna put in a tackle on Messi in midfield now”. I hope he trusts his teammates a bit more for the return leg. At the very least I don’t expect him to underestimate Ibra.
As for the stage fright, I think it will be there at the start but we’ll get over it a bit. Without most of our ‘star’ players-RVP, Cesc, AA23, Gallas- I think the character of the team as a whole (the one Mazza is referring to above) will kick in earlier because we won’t be relying on anyone in particular per se. So everyone needs to step up and do their bit.
Let’s see how it goes at Wolves that should give us a better indication. Irregardless, like Fred says, I think the hype about the difference in quality may be a tiny bit over the top (in spite of the pasting we received). Bookies giving 6.75 to 1. I’ll take that one.
I’d take it too Ozi, but I will be really surprised if I got a payout.
Yeah, ummm… if Barcelona aren’t that good, and they PLAYED US OFF THE PITCH for the ENTIRE first half… at the Emirates…
what does that say about us?
What does it say about La Liga?
That every team in their league except for Real Madrid are SHIT?
Because they are 20 points up.
Fred, I know we throw down a lot but we’re totally in agreement with this game, from how it was played to the risks taken. I’ve already agreed with most of what you said with my post on yesterday. I used the term star-struck instead of stage fright but it’s the same idea.
The Camp Nou is a daunting place to play but if our boys keep their nerve and get at their back line, we can win. We can’t win if we sit back and let them have the ball. They’re too good and we’re no good at sitting back at all.
Vermaelen’s a great player but he’s not as good without leadership along side him. He needs Campbell or Gallas to keep him focused. Song and Vermaelen is not the right answer.
From my viewing of the match, you could tell Cesc physically was not up to the task – more so in the first half; after Theo scored, something kicked into gear.
Arshavin gave the ball away 2 of his first 3 touches; Diaby 5 of his first 6 touches. Sagna, Song, Cesc, & Bendtner ALL added to our inability to hold possession. Most of these in our defensive third placing extra pressure on the back line.
Even b4 the match you’d have to ask yourself, how do you include so many players coming off injury and expect to have the fitness level to press? Barca?
Okay from a psychological advantage, we’ve lined up with our most experienced players. Yet, fitness is critical to execution. Diaby had the ball taken off his feet repeatedly both halves. He
was not sharp and looked out of sort / sync defensively – not the usual Diaby recently.
As for other players I thought Clichy was dynamite. How many passes did he intercept? Took the ball from Messi. What a workhorse down the left flank – and even his crosses gave Barca some concern.
Nasri and Bendtner had solid performances.
Fred has made some good points about Barca. They are not invincible. Arsenal just need to find their composure and have patience.
Again, we are underdogs on Tuesday – so what. 3 points v. Wolves (and no injuries) and a draw in the ManU – Chelsea conflict and we have MORE motivation.
Spot on Ars, Cesc did not look up for it at all in the 1st half. Like Gallas I cannot understand why Wenger played him.
As for performances I thought Song was our only outstanding player in the 1st half. I did not see him contributing to our inability to hold possession at all. I felt his distribution was very good considering the circumstance.
Andez, Mazza, what does Fabregas have to do to earn your kudos?
For five years now, he has been top assist man in the whole of Europe!!! You still accused him of not taking games by the scruff … so this season he has scored a record number of goals … on several occasions he has single-handedly changed the complexion of several games … yet you still denigrate his influence!
And to make matters worse you compare him to Denilson!!! I cant think of a greater insult … you guys might as well just call his mother a whore and be done with it … no point going as far as making a comparison to “sweet ankles” :-D
PS: And, no, even as an AM at peak age, with absolutely no defensive responsibilities, Denilson will NEVER be able to do what Fabregas does. Not even in his dreams.
Although I hate to do it, I have to agree with you Fred.
“Denilson will NEVER be able to do what Fabregas does”
“And to make matters worse you compare him to Denilson!!! I cant think of a greater insult … you guys might as well just call his mother a whore and be done with it”
HA!
What a weird subject this is. Fred and Art in one corner and Andez and Mazza in other.
My reading of Mazza’s comments is that they’re being somewhat overblown. It’s hardly a complete write-off. More like the word that Andez used…”overrated.’
While I completely understand the shock expressed by the other side (and the Denilson comparison IS way off), I’m more inclined to agree with what Maz and ‘dez are generally saying.
Fab is a really, really talented football player. I doubt anyone disagrees with that. And his stat line obviously looks great this year.
But I do think it’s fair to ask if we rate him just a little too high.
He does take matches off. And parts of matches. As opposed to someone such as, say, Rooney he does not appear to have that motor that never stops running. I think Maz is spot on that Cesc is not ideally suited an emotional leader/Captain. More like a great Lieutenant, he needs to be led on a squad that has someone even a little bit better than he. So he is consistently encouraged to keep the level of his performance high and even raise it.
He has the potential to raise his game. But as the best player at Arsenal, which is he is by miles, I don’t believe he will reach it.
And, frankly, his mother seems a little loose to me. ;-)
I’ll make it weirder, I’ll jump in with Fred & Art. Not sure what exactly folks expect from Cesc, when he has taken on the captaincy, team leader, scored goals this year, and is always near the top in assists.
He is a LEADER on the pitch.
How old is he?
You’ll understand what he means to the team when he’s gone.
Please, don’t mis- (or partial) read me.
Best. Player. On. AFC. By. Miles.
So, of course, if he’s gone, and not replaced, we’re going to miss him. (It’s kinda patronizing to suggest I wouldn’t understand that. I mean, duh.)
But, as it’s currently built, we agree this team is lacking in several significant areas. It’s not going to happen for us without someone better than Fab on THIS team.
I’d certainly rather see us add the kind of player Cesc needs to raise his game, but it doesn’t appear the way AW is inclined to think. So, no, I don’t think Fab is the kind of guy you can build a team around.
Again, I don’t believe he’s suited to lead/be the best player at Arsenal right now. And I’m tired of everything at Arsenal being based on “You just wait a few more years…” At least if you’re going to point at his age, I think you have to acknowledge he may not be mature enough yet. But I’m not sure that will ever be his game.
It doesn’t mean he’s not a brilliant footballer. Just that he may not be one of those top 5-10% guys, who are always at their best and a great leader who consistently brings out the best in others.
Really, is that such a horrible criticism?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/mattslater/2010/03/arsenals_suitors_start_saving.html
Regarding this link that nipuna posted above about the ownership of Arsenal and how it may change in the coming months: I DO NOT want Alisher Usmanov to take a commanding share of the club! Call it whatever you will, but I got a bad feeling about this guy and his intentions. I would be okay w/ things staying the way they are, or w/ Kroenke taking over. Either of those options are fine.
This stuff is complicated, so luckily Wikipedia has an entire article titled “Ownership of Arsenal F.C.” (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ownership_of_Arsenal_F.C.) that helps explain some of it. There’s even a nice pie chart showing what % of shares are currently owned by who. But there are still some things I’m not sure I fully understand.
vibe4arsenal Reply:
April 1st, 2010 at 6:55 pm
With the momentum having swung our way, having a healthy player on the pitch, rather than a hobbling Fab, might not have made a difference? Because we never score late goals?
——————————————–
Since when we are allowed to use FOUR subs?
Ah, that, yeah.
LOL!
that’s FUNNY!
It’s becoming clear that this team is more about perspiration than inspiration, at least in a collective sense, which is a bit odd considering we have a number of so called flair players. For whatever reason, this crop can’t gel together to form a cohesive unit either defensively or offensively. The former is to be expected but the latter is a worry and consistent one for Wenger. I’m still yet to see one accomplised technical performance this season or last season befitting a team that invites such accolades. The 07/08 team produced a string of them, albeit that squad had it’s own issues, primarily lack of numbers and options.
What this squad does have in absolute spades is an amazing amount of spirit and character. I’m actually astounded at the metronomic way we keep going in games and clutches of games when the technical level is so mediocre. I say that because it should take more out of the team game per game when it’s such a ‘struggle’. Then again, what this squad does have is numbers and a number of dangerous individuals that can make a difference regardless of the overall stuttering dynamic. So with these game-changers flittering in and out of the team, allied to tremendous squad togetherness, we have a unlikely unit that trundles on and on….and on. At least Wenger can take solace from that, it’s just a shame the aspect of the game he is so renowned for is probably at its lowest ember for manier year, and the absence of that is shedding more light on one his less refined features of management; a complete inability to drill any sort of defensive nous into his team post the invincibles.
A part of me wouldn’t be surprised to see us have an unlikely dalliance with success next week. Fabregas in his current guise is quite frankly a bore to watch, and Nasri seems to be the better option as playmaker. However, the space between the lines we leave, and Barca’s ability to make space against much more compact units than us, leaves us open to possibly one of the most embarrassing nights of Wenger’s career. Barca’s away form might fluctuate, and we probably saw their best last night in that sense, but they very rarely disappoint at home. We will need to show a level of football that this current crop have never shown before to do the impossible or even make it competitive.
I just read this to my wife,who said, “He seems right”….
Picked a perceptive one there Steve ;)
How cute is it that Steve is reading YAMA to his wife? And that she’s pretending to listen?
Good job it was one of Mazza’s less curse-y posts. ;-)
LOL
I start to feel Cesc is getting a bit overrated.
That may sound outrageous, afterall he’s our current top goalscorer, as a midfielder.
But I think we should not underestimated that “free role” Cesc is having which contributed to his success this season.
I look at Denilson, a very similar type of player as Cesc. With a lesser passing range.
Denilson been struggling playing as DM. But likewise, if we try Cesc at DM, I bet Cesc would be looking just as bad as Denilson.
On the other hand, if you give Denilson the freerole, the freedom to roam around, instead of trying to do the holding job, to play with discipline… I bet, though he may not be as good as Cesc, we would be seeing a far more better Denilson than we are right now.
My point is – if there is anything we do not lack of with this current side – it’s the technically sounded playmaker.
At the moment, many of them are playing out of position. Arshavin, Rosicky, Nasri. They are all at their best playing as a playmaker with freedom to roam.
But because with Cesc’s status at Arsenal, he will forever be the number 1 choice taking up the role.
Now I imagine if we give Arshavin the freerole instead of Cesc, the Russian may go on and score more goals than Cesc. What with his clever running and better finishing.
Someone pointed out (I forgot who) we may turn out missing Gallas even more than Cesc. I tend to agree.
I’m always loathe to criticise Cesc because I’ve done it in the past and then he’s come back and made me look an idiot for doubting him.
What I would say is that too often he physically doesn’t seem to be at his optimum or even mentally for that matter. I’m not sure what to make of that. Even the games this season that he showed individual power and inspiration were in exceptional circumstances in some ways. The Villa game he came on as a sub and with Villa tiring to an extent, and the Spurs goal was just after RVP’s opener. Of course, you can’t take away from his achievements in those two games, but for me doesn’t do enough in big games to suggest to me that he’s the new mean machine that Wenger tries to portray him as. He needs to be more dynamic, MORE often, or at least threaten to be.
It’s also for this reason that I don’t think Cesc suits this title as our inspirational leader. “Barca have Messi, Arsenal have Cesc”, kind of talk. Cesc is at his best probing and prompting from deep, and occasionally making a run beyond. However because he’s seen as our leader by everyone, I think he feels as if he needs to do it all by himself and become a Messi type player. Which means he plays too high up the pitch and leaves us defensively exposed.
Cesc CAN be a player worth building a team around if he can consistently display the physical power needed to justify such a status, but as yet he cannot do this over a season, so for now I think he should drop deeper against the top teams.
LOL.
Sounds like the beginnings of greasing the skids in case Cesc is SOLD!
I’m sort of reading “We didn’t really need him anyway, we have others that can play his position… ”
or trying to convince ourselves that he isn’t that important to the team?!
Weird to read this, sorry… but I’m not really buying it.
But if he gets sold for MANY million, it will be OK…
and it will be GREAT for the profit margin and to pay down the debt.
All good. Positive either way, stay or go.
Well, we’ll see how influential he WAS, and how good Nasri / and – or / others can be in his place over the next 7 games.
I think you’re right Maz. For the last 5 years we’ve been trying to refind our mojo, create a new style. But it hasn’t really come together. That’s probably due to a number of factors, but one is the regular and persistent injuries to key players.
Wenger has tried to fashion a side to play football that requires an intimate understanding and confidence between the players. Unfortunately injury has blighted that continually. Even this year which has been reasonably successful – in as much as we’ve stayed in touch in the EPL race – we are still carrying a gaggle of injured players, guys who have to be carefully managed, can’t play twice in four days etc. How can you gel as a team and produce cohesive performances of technical football when you don’t have a regular team? Add to that we have a guy at the apex that is never around.
Yep, which is why it’s very hard to come to conclusions on certain players etc. Even the comment I wrote above on Cesc could very much be construed as harsh when I remember the amount of hamstring injuries he got this season and how good and physically powerful he was just before them (The Burnley game away comes to mind).
but for me doesn’t do enough in big games to suggest to me that he’s the new mean machine that Wenger tries to portray him as. He needs to be more dynamic, MORE often, or at least threaten to be
—————-
Yes that’s very true maz.
@kiwi, very good point. Remember the Henry generation used to say they instinctively know where each other is when they are on the pitch?
that’s the result of week in week out playing “together”.
You can’t develop an understanding like that with players in and out injured.
As I always insist this current side has far better depth than the class of 2002-04.
I sure hell don’t remember there were so many wide players to rotate back then.
But there’s also a downside – that it’s very hard for them to develop the understanding between teammates like yesteryears.
Take left side midfield. Pires and Cole used to strike a great partnership down left. But today with Clichy, he isn’t sure who’s gonna play ahead of him on the pitch the very next week.
Apart from Fabregas being a bore and Nasri replacing him (he will do anyway) and your usual pessimism, that was a really good evaluation of where our team is at. You raised some good points Mazza.
At times we have played some good Wengerball this season though and before RvPs injury we were on course for over 100 goals so I do not think our team dynamic is as deficient as you suggest. I think defensively under Wenger we have always been frail to some degree but attacking wise this season all we have been missing is that man who an play at the centre of the attack in the 4-3-3 effectively. I maintain that had RvP continued in the vain of form he had prior to his injury we would be top of the league right now.
Only time will tell how we go in the return leg. My points are that Barcelona played out of their skin and their manager and fans have stated that. Despite playing out of their skin and ‘in the zone’ they suffer what we often suffer….. a mix of the end product being lacking and then the game moving on to a different phase. This is not unique nor a one-off we see it happen regularly.
I was neutral with my expectations pre-game which probably explains my upbeat mood at coming out 2-2 and coming out with momentum. This was always going to be a massive challenge. This period of Barcelona’s history will be remembered as one of the greats like AC Milan’s under Capello – so it was always going to be a titanic mission for us to stay in the tie.
It won’t take a miracle to get a result next Tuesday, just the right series of events. True, if Barcelona fire and apply themselves for 90+ minutes we could get hammered yet that’s just one possible scenario. This is what makes football so jolly interesting – it is a low scoring game that often shapes around a few key events.
For me, the obvious is critical, it’s important that we have a decent starting line-up and that we have a few decent options on the bench. If we come out with the wrong team/formation/attitude it could be embarrassing. On the other side, if we work hard and press them like they did us Barcelona are 100% able to get wobbly again. They have all the expectation and pressure.
I was among those who doubted this teams ability to respond to adversity – I was embarrassed at the way we got tonked by ManU and Chelsea twice. I couldn’t see the mental toughness in the side to respond. Well, we’re all grateful they did demonstrate that ability – and just as grateful that ManU and Chelsea weren’t up to putting daylight between us and them. Now they have another massive challenge – going to the Nou Camp and getting a win. I’m also really interested to see Barca’s response…..
Great, balanced post. As usual.
We’ve got to attack Barcelona in the return leg if we want to advance. They defend well as a team but their defenders and keeper are a weakness. I mentioned in the build up at the top of the thread that Alves and Maxwell were suspect and that their CB’s would struggle to cope with Bendtner. I also wrote that Theo’s pace would trouble them. We made our money when we attacked their defenders.
Diaby was disappointing. I completely got wrong the impact he I think he was star struck. He’s got to pull his head out for the return leg. Samir is beginning to play for the team now instead of himself. That’s good to see because this Nasri can help us win games. I’ve always held that Denilson is a good player. When your camp is being overrun, the simple passes, despite being less glamorous, are the most effective. Without those sideways passes, Arsenal never builds the momentum to get out of its own half. It’s impossible to build momentum if you can’t keep the ball. Denilson helped us both win the ball and keep possession; something we struggled to do.
Vermaelen’s a good player but is still young. When he’s playing against a special player, he tends to over-focus on that player and, sometimes, neglect his role in team defense. I pointed this out in the second Chelsea game with Drogba. We saw it again against Porto when they had that kid who’s scored like 20 goals in 20 games for them. Well, it’s happened again last night with Messi. What’s most important is that he remain in sync with the rest of the back five. That was kindergarten defending from him on their two goals last night. You can never leave your keeper exposed like that against a striker; especially one of Zlatan’s quality. It is imperative Arsenal extend Gallas’ contract while that kid is still developing. If not, the media will be talking about a sophomore jinx.
Andez, it’s not the manager’s job to manage the critics. It’s his job to manage the team. If Barcelona had scored early goals with Gallas on the pitch, the critics might have said it stupid to start a guy who hasn’t played in six weeks against Barcelona. Damn the critics.
No what I were saying is –
It’s far easier for critics to manage the team with HINDSIGHT. Cos you are looking at our ALTERNATIVES after event had happend. Managers do not have this luxury. Look at how Ferguson played Rooney when he knew he’s not 100% fit? What’s the difference between what Fergie and Wenger done?
For a manager, their job is far more complicated.
If you were Wenger, what would u do? Sure, you know starting both Cesc and Gallas run the risk of them suffering injury setback again.
But you also know Barca are a world class team.
I don’t think Wenger gave a damn on what the media think. Or else he would have just gone out and buy buy buy.
He wanted to have his strongest team possible to take on Barca. what’s wrong with that?
As for injury. There’s always a risk of it, even in training.
Bottom line is – as I said – Hindsight is always easy.
Had he rested both Gallas and Cesc and we lost. What would you guys be saying then?
OK … lets say Wenger lost the gamble by starting Gallas and Fabregas… but what was his excuse leaving Fabregas ON … when he was clearly in lots of trouble after the penalty?!!!
Those critical few steps SURELY aggravated his injury because once a crack appears on your bone, every single step increases the network of cracks!!
Fabregas was putting his career at risk right there. And Wenger should have have acted like the man in charge. It was a SIMPLE decision. It wasnt like this was the last minutes of the second leg or anything.
Ferguson would never put Rooney at such risk.
I agree with this… could have ruined his career or at least the WC.
Its questionable whether he should have even started.
Now the injury list is in and we know the negatives, we can look at the positives for Sat. and beyond .
Nasri is in the mood to step up and fill the Cesc slot. When he played centrally before he made a big impact, I thought. Ditto Diaby — but only if he’s in the mood for some driving runs. He’s still pretty variable.
Denilson is suddenly a workhorse with a big more bite.
Sol and Song at CB? Not ideal. Song is better as the DM. But anything is better than Silvestre.
As I said earlier, Bendtner is now working as the spearhead – making assists, linking up the attack etc.
Theo makes a great supersub. He would not have made any difference in the first half against Barca. Our problems all stemmed from midfield, where we didn’t press and harry. But he gives us width and speed, so it makes sense to start him on Sat. with Arshavin now out. We can play 4-5-1 and put Rosicky on the left wing.
The good news is that Wolves should give us a fairly straightforward home win to regroup before heading into the lions den. And Chelsea-Manure could well end in a draw, letting us back in with a sniff at the title chase.
I predict Tuesday will see us revert to under-seige mode with hopes of a Theo breakaway goal. We will not attempt to outplay them, so much as try to beat them.
I agree, Fred, that it was a poor decision to start Gallas last night when he wasn’t really fit yet. I said the same thing about Bendtner starting against Chelesea but met quite a bit of resistance. You’re most prone to injury when you first come back and not necessarily the same injury. It would have been good enough to have Gallas on the bench but don’t let him start his first game back in such a big game. We could have used Gallas for the rest of this season.
Likewise, about Fabregas. All players are going to want to play but I didn’t expect he or Gallas to start last night. The problem for Wenger is psychological in that you are desperate to have your star players fit for such a big game that you will lie to yourself and say in your mind that they are fit.
It’s a challenge for the physio as well as it’s his job to get the players fit. Physios will know that a player will look you in the eye and lie to you so that you can clear them to play. You have to wonder if the physio was trumped by the boss.
Had we started Sol instead of Gallas and were down 0-2, critics would be saying it’s what a piece of stupid management from Wenger, that when Gallas is available and he decided to start a slow CB Sol Campbell.
Hindsight.
As for not taking off Cesc. Was it Wenger’s decision? Or was the player himself decided to solider on? As far as I”m concerned, when a player decided he couldn’t continue, no way the manager, not just Wenger, any manager would insist him to play on.
Besides, with only a few minutes left, did it make any difference to the match’s outcome whether Cesc’ on or off?
I agree, but Cesc should not have stayed on the pitch post injury.
With the momentum having swung our way, having a healthy player on the pitch, rather than a hobbling Fab, might not have made a difference? Because we never score late goals?
We had used our 3 subs when Cesc was injured.
I am aware of that, but he had a BROKEN BONE.
If he was hobbling around, possibly making the injury worse, what would the point be?
For the Wolves game I would go:
Almunia
Sagna – Campbell – Vermalaen – Traore
Diaby – Song – Denilson
Walcott – Bendtner – Eduardo
Against Barca:
Almunia
Sagna – Campbell – Vermalaen – Clichy
Diaby – Song – Nasri
Walcott – Bendtner – Rosicky
I dont buy the foolish assumption that Campbell cant start two consecutive games. Campbell is as fast as Ibrahimovic. Campbell is faster than Denilson.
I think way too much credit is being given to Barca for last nights performance. Sure it was good, but a lot of it had to do with tactical stupidity from Wenger’s part and poor starting lineup.
First of all, why start a CB who hasnt played for 2 months in such a high octane game?! That not only compromises the team it also ensures the guy gets another injury!
Secondly, Wenger was utterly reckless and nearly criminal for NOT taking off Fabregas, when he was limping after the second goal. SURE, the player would not want to come off and all, but looking at the highlights, he was limping VERY badly.
The duration of an injury is determined not only by the cause but mostly by what happens in the few minutes immediately after! Fabregas was RUNNING around on a fractured leg! So instead of a small crack on his fibia, you have a rapidly spreading network of cracks for every step he took!!! Instead of 1 or 2 weeks out you have 6+ weeks. And thats what the frequently wrong Arsenal docs say… for all we know it could be 3 to 4 months.
Wenger deserves a hard smack on the face for that stunning piece of management.
Bullshit.
Barcelona were excellent for about 70 minutes of the match. They deserve all the credit. It would not have mattered what line-up we put out there.
Wenger has done a great job, and we drew 2-2, as he brought on Theo and Denilson, and they both played really well.
Imbecile response not bothering to answer any of my points.
I expect nothing less.
yes, let me give a detailed response to:
“Wenger deserves a hard smack on the face”
I think that IDIOTIC statement deserves only “Bullshit” as a response.
and that’s whatcha got.
Diaby was INCREDIBLE against Barca! Lets hope for (not) more of the same…
No, actually he wasn’t… he’s never been incredible, and he was less than average yesterday.
But Denilson, was close to being nearly incredible… and Almunia had an incredible 1st half, and 18 seconds of the 2nd half too!
Arsene’s love for the CL over the league is pretty clear.
Arsene rests Nasri and Arsha for the Brum game and claims they are not 100% fit.
But for Barca game, he has no qualms in starting Gallas (hardly fit), Cesc (40% fit) and Arsh (not 100%).
Not the first time either.
Remember Arsene playing a weak team against Liverpool in the league between the two CL games against the same opponent in 2007-08.
He does it every year. It’s incredible really. And it back fires on him every year.
CL > League > FA Cup > Carling Cup.
I see a pecking order. ;)
Oh, well… he at least said it was a mistake taking the chance on Gallas…
so he is possibly learning from his errors…
We’re closer this year than we’ve been recently.
and still have a chance in BOTH competitions.
Terrible news. Gallas out, Cesc out and Arsha missing at least 3 weeks!
We won’t be collapsing or anything, we are certainly stronger than that now.
But hey, this certainly makes the already extremely difficult task of winning anything, all the more improbable. :(
true, but we are already winners…
we played nice football, are in the hunt for trophies, and lowered the debt…
GOOD SEASON, no matter how the next 7 games go.
Up with the Mighty Arsenal Football Club.
Breaking news (no pun intended):
Cesc out for the season: http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/injured-fabregas-ruled-out-for-the-season
This seems problematic….
From what I’ve heard he is out 6 weeks, which is the rest or our season, but thankfully he should still be able to go to South Africa.
1st Nasri, then Ramsey, now Cesc.
Curious to see how Arsene approaches the line up for Wolves with the match v. Barca on Tuesday.
Which field players will he want to start for Barca & who will be rested on Saturday?
If the Brum game is anything to go by, key players for the return may be rested.
Now who they are, is anyone’s guess. :)
Guess Saturday’s line up will reveal our manager’s thinking.
Didn’t yesterday’s line-up already reveal that?
line up for Barca had almost everyone available……
with injuries to Cesc, Arshavin, and Gallas – they aren’t options for Saturday or Tuesday……
so my point is for the Barca tie, how will Arsene rate key players to rest against Wolves.
Everybody available when you consider Gallas was just coming off a long-term injury, and Cesc had a banged up knee. That they were available for this match, under those circumstances, is my point.
As much as we are decimated with the loss of Gallas, Arshavin, and Cesc, we have player options at these positions
———————————————————————-
This is true for Cesc and AA only. Which is why I said above I’m most worried about Gallas’s lay-off.
Don’t you believe that Song is going to have to alternate with Sol?
Yeah, but still. We are so thin there. And Song may be an excellent all-round player, but he’s a DM, not a CB. We need him at the DM spot, and we need a real CB at the CB spot.
Wenger has always seen Song as CB. Maybe as fans we are so jaded by past Denilson performances that Song looks world class at DM.
For our run-in, I can see Song and Sol rotating matches with Vermaelen. Denilson or Diaby will have to step in at DM. Maybe Song playing DM when not at CB.
On paper this is not our best option, but now is the time for role players to step up.
Our focus must switch to Wolves & finding a way to take the 3 points.
As much as we are decimated with the loss of Gallas, Arshavin, and Cesc, we have player options at these positions. Its the end of a long season and OTHER CLUBS ARE GOING TO HAVE NEW INJURY ISSUES.
ManU v. Chelsea – the match will be very physical and very likely for both teams to finish with some
key players at the trainer’s table. Ditto for Barca this weekend.
We need to remind ourselves how this team is different than those of the past 2 years. This group of players consistently finds ways to take points at the end of every close match.
Wenger’s youngsters are coming of age.
The whole central defense thing is absolutely incredible though.
Every single person in the world could tell you Gallas was going to get injured at some point this season. Now, he doesnt trust Silvestre, and right so. The guy doesnt even make the bench anymore. So why didnt he SORT the position out properly rather than buying another old man who he cant trust against big teams.
So one fit CB, a partner CB who always gets injured in the second half of every season … backed up by two geriatrics that you dont trust.
Classic mismanagement.
What year did you write this originally? ;-)
Oh, I think Wenger has done a great job with the limited funds he has at his disposal.
He doesn’t want to bring in another CB, because that will keep the “kids” pushed back in the pecking order, and Gallas is just unlucky.
Song or Sol will be OK for the run in…
We are in the hunt for the league title, solidly in 3rd… and even though last nights match might have killed our confidence, and we lost 3 key players, we still have a chance in the return.
That’s pretty good management in my book.
We are in a great position that every team in England, except the top 2, would die for.
AND, we didn’t have to spend crazy money … we MADE money, and lowered the stadium debt.
That, is a GOOD season.
With at least 7 matches to go.
Should be a fun run in to the finish line.
Agree.
So far it looks like Andrei is NOT out for the long haul and will miss up to 3 weeks.
I’ve gotten back to updating the Rumor Mill page and the Injury News page.
With Arshavin out MAYBE Vela could find his way to the bench?
for Arsenal to win anything this season, it will come from a ‘team effort’….
with Cesc, Gallas, and Arshavin out, this is the time for others to step up!
Rosicky, when he’s played, has been contributing nicely to our flow. We now need for Vela, Eduardo, and Theo to find their game.
well, I wouldn’t count on much from Vela or Eduardo, and Theo for 7 games? Maybe he’ll step up…
We won’t win anything this season without the 3 we have lost from yesterday…
but the season has been a smashing success regardless for Arsenal FC.
:)
IT’s funny – Pep called this the best game they’ve played away in the CL. Even better than last year.
I’d also like to remind everyone of this. What we saw yesterday is exactly what Chelsea saw 2 years ago. As a matter of fact Chelsea managed one shot – the goal. United saw pretty much the same thing. Calling us average against Barca is misleading. They’ve pretty much done this to every English and Spanish team they’ve faced.
The hope I have is that little ol’ Ruben Kazan can go into Nou Camp and win – then Arsenal should.
great point!
DAG, I know the scoreline ended 2-2… and the game had many twists, turns, and multiple plots…
But the fact is, they played us off the pitch for MOST of the game…
and if not for Almunia’s saves in the 1st half, and Barca not putting the game to bed, we could have been embarrassed.
Yes, anything can happen in one game… but the chances of a win at Barcelona, are not good. It’s a long shot, made even longer without the TALENT and EXPERIENCE that Gallas, Arshavin and Cesc provide.
Especially the experience… playing on the road in the CL for all the marbles…
“kids” don’t perform often in that type of setting.
But if you think long-term, it doesn’t really matter.
We’ve already won.
It will provide a good experience for next year…
and by some miracle we win… !!
more money for the next round and more seasoning for team.
Win Win situation.
Crazy crazy game. Thoughts
* a bit like Arsenal play – dominate the opposition but fail to kill them off
* barca were on another planet in the first half; technically so much superior, but we made up for it in the 2nd half through grit and determination
* too much loss in the game – Gallas out, Cesc possibly out, Arsha injured :(
* can we cope in return leg? who knows – just watch and find out
* can we cope in league? looks tough without two key players, but no one dare predict what can happen
Watch and find out, we will…
should be fun, as long as it doesn’t resemble the first 20 minutes of this one.
Can we cope in the league? That would be minus 3 key players…
I doubt it, as we’ll need to win every match, but … same scenario as the return match at Barca, it will be interesting regardless.
DAG, amazing prediction on the score. The way the first half was going, I didn’t think the score would be close to that, but I guess you knew. Can you please look into your crystal ball and give a glimpse into next week’s score-line? On second thought…I rather not know. I have a week to imagine miracles. Italo Calvino once said something along the lines of that the films we make in our minds are sometimes better than the real ones that get made. Well sometimes the scores that soccer fans can imagine in their minds are much better than the real ones :)
Although I can’t get Mazza’s fab statement out of my mind:
“I am worried about the second leg though. The first one should be competitive but the second at the Nou Camp could get very Messi.”
The first leg was not that competitive (not over 90 min) so does that mean the second leg could be Messi free? ;)
Where was Messi today?
There were reports of Messi sightings today but I was more concerned with the Arsenal players who were mysteriously abducted & then released repeatedly throughout the first hour. Something strange was going on. At times, it looked like there were 10 outfield Arsenal players, then it looked like a few went missing and then the number was back to 10 again.
Messi, he was watching the other Barcelona players run rings around our guys, thought he’d rest up for the return leg!
(Song did a good job of marking him, mostly)
All this talk of Cesc with broken leg, April Fool’s spin. (I hope)
Sorry.
He’s DONE.
6 weeks.
Might miss the WC.
Cracked bone.
For me our difficulty in the opening 20 minutes was ‘big game pressure’, specifically for Sagna, Diaby, and Arshavin. Arshavin seems to have lost it. These players visibly lost their ‘usual’ composure.
Diaby struggled the entire match. Eboue (when he came on) also had trouble with his passing and touch. No way any team can hold their own (ball possession) with this many players succumbing to pressure.
Clichy had a terrific contest. We are seeing Nasri blossom into real class. Denilson was tremendous, doing everything well that he’s usually criticized for…..
Bendtner; great run down the right wing – beating 2 Barca players, then serving a surgical cross to Diaby. Great thru ball to Theo for the 1st goal; intelligent soft header to Cesc that set up the penalty. Countless times strong enough to hold the ball under pressure and maintain our flow.
Cesc’s performance was inspiring, knowing he started the match with his fitness in question.
So important for Arsenal to end the match upbeat, controlling the tempo and keeping Barca on their heels.
With Gallas, Arshavin removed from the match – avg. age of our field players was probably 23.
Very proud of the Arsenal effort.
The irony is Barcelona played us off the pitch in a manner I haven’t seen….. ever, and yet it’s 2-2. So it’s half time and still game on.
You can read any number of things in to this game and result depending on your current view of Arsenal and Barcelona. What strikes me however, is the simple truth that ‘playing better’ does not assure you of the ‘right result’. Barcelona game us a masterclass in the football we aspire to play, and yet at half time in this tie it’s all tied up. Sure they have the away goals advantage and a home return leg, yet ‘form’ and ‘predictions’ fall over ALL THE TIME.
We saw today in the most ironic of circumstances that you can get played off the park for most of 70 min’s and still get the result. That’s football. And that’s why any team needs a degree of pragmatism – even a real deal champion like Barcelona. In a sense the ultimate lesson for Arsenal is that being outplayed is not the same as being beaten.
In football, I’m superstitious.
I believe they have let us off the hook.
They should have killed us and buried us. But they didn’t.
In football, this is something could come back and haunt you.
My feeling exactly Andez. Just read a Barcelona website and they were spewing. Saying exactly what you said and I think – they should have killed off the game.
But they didn’t.
Teams aren’t robots, they have a collective character and exhibit moods. Barca’s play after goal number 2 suggested they thought the game was won. It wasn’t.
The other interesting aspect is what I alluded to above. The website I referred to said it was the best they’ve play in a long time. So…. let’s see if we get a repeat. I can see anything happening. Sure, we could get a tonking, then again they might be less fluid, a bit nervous and we could well pip them. Bring it on ;-)
Following this train of thought, when we let a lesser team stay with us in a match, what usually happens the next match? Do they improve upon their performance, and completely overwhelm our superior quality?
Or do we set things to right, especially at home, and take care of business? The way we should have the first time?
Nothing at all wrong with optimism and hoping for the best. And ‘anything can happen’ is literally impossible to argue with.
But only the most hopeful fan sees this kind of scenario coming true.
They’re better. They dominated us. (Without one of the best players in the world even being a factor.) It’s amazing we got the result we did. And we won’t have our best player next time. It really does take an excessively credulous belief in and reverence for supernatural beings to see us getting anything but thrashed there.
But that will not stop me from tuning in, and hoping I am wrong.
True, true.
But the thing is they are not exactly vastly superior to us!
Eh? They’re in a totally different league to us.
People said after the first leg at United last season that United might regret not making more of their dominance at Old Trafford, and we could take advantage at the Emirates. But as we saw, quality is quality and we got spanked at the Emirates.
If anything, next week will be the opposite. It will be even more of an embarassment. That chasm in class is so big that it makes superstitions and such completely irrelevant, imo.
This team is not very good. Technically and in terms of being compact between the lines, one of the worst Wenger teams I’ve ever seen – probably the worst. I rate the 05/06 higher than this lot. We just seem to have incredible spirit and lots talented match-winners that can strike at any given moment, regardless of our collective performance, and somehow we’re still in the title tace.
You might be correct Mazza, there is a big difference in quality and class between the two teams, its evident.
But the best team doesn’t always win, and…
I bet we make more profit than they did this year!
:)
Exactly my thought Vibe…
I think of Porto away… then we SPANKED them at the Emirates.
Of course we’ll all watch with hope, but not sure “there is a chance” means much.
Wow.
I don’t know how I feel. I was in a bar that was predominantly Barca fans. It was all I could do not to cry when it was 2-0 when they were singing in the bar.
Theo is the MOTM – for no other reason that even as good as Nasri and Almunia were they did not change the complexion of the match. It was clear that for once Theo’s pace was a threat – and so was he.
Before his goal, he was fed a similar pass from Eboue in the box and if not for a Puyol tackle he had the angle on Valdes. The play from Bendtner in was better weighted than Eboue’s and Theo just blasted past the defender. Actually Theo had that all the time he played.
Nasri is so coming into his own and I think he will thrive without Cesc in the picture for a while. That shot he had was a near impossible angle it missed by what inches?
The save of the game was not Almunia’s but Valdes direct pin-point stop of Vermaelen’s text book header. It would’ve made the game 1-1 and produced maybe a different feel to the game.
IN the first half it looked like Barca were gang busters for the first 20 minutes in an attempt to overwhelm the defence and get shots on Manny. When Manny stood on his head the pace actually slowed down and match was a little more patient.
Also Barca are to be commended for their attack but they also let off the gas peddle after they were up 2-0. As much as I hate Chelsea what you have to commend them on is their brute force of going for more even when they have the game clearly won. Barca didn’t do that.
Finally, while I will miss Willie G -I am looking forward to Sol playing against Barca again in hopes of seeing a little 2006 magic revisited. Also, if Willie G is done for the season, could it be that this was his last moment as a Gunner
hey DAG, how were their reaction when we leveled the score?! :)
It was very very quiet. They were stunned. That first 10 minutes they were boisterous. Then they quieted down. After the two goals they were signing and they were laughing at Arsenal’s position. Until Walcott scored. Then it got over them that we weren’t going to lie down. Then came the penalty. I look at it this way – If Vermie’s was a red so was this.
Which brings me to my next point. The refing in the entire CL this year has been woeful. I can’t think of a match I’ve watched (not just Arsenal) that has had bad calls that have effected the outcome in some way. Maybe not directly but have had some sort of momentum altering effect. They’ve just been pitiful.
That’s interesting… because I read on this site that the CL refereeing was better.
They call all the fouls against Arsenal that we usually don’t get called in the EPL, so it suits us better.
Funny, we were the ones that were more “physical” today, and we took down a few Barca players purposely to try and “slow” them down and from over-running us.
Exactly what other teams do to us in the EPL.
(though not all game long)
I recall people saying that CL refs called more fouls, allowed less harsh tackles.
Nowhere did anyone claim they have better judgment and decision-making all around, ie situations involving PK’s, players arguing w/ them, etc.
The two are not the same thing. Hell, I have very limited referee training, and I could call more fouls than an EPL ref, but that doesn’t make me ‘better’.
I was thinking the same thing about Gallas in that I hope that was not his last game in an Arsenal shirt.
And I think that Nasri shot in the 22nd min was maybe Arsenal’s first shot on net? It was amazingly close and as soon as he shot, I thought it was going in.
Funny thing is how whenever we play against the big name clubs in Europe, some people often predicted it would get ugly.. for us.
As if we will automatically get trashed by a club’s NAME. I remember reading the similar stuff prior to the Real Madrid away tie a few years back (which we won 1-0 with a Henry goal).. then 2 seasons ago I read again the same stuff prior to the AC Milan tie at San Siro (which we won 2-0).
But well.. I supposed if people keep on predicting we are going to get trashed, the law of average says sooner or later they will get their prediction right.
But when that does happen, except from earning the pleasure to come back and tell us “I told you so”.. Are there really any other fun those folks could get out of a bad result from the team they are supposed to love and support?
Likewise, people (and I don’t exactly excuse myself from this) thought it would be a cakewalk before our semi against Villareal in 06, b/c they aren’t a big name club. I’m not one to think we are automatically doomed when we play big-name teams, but I do sometimes have a bad tendency to overlook smaller teams.
true. In recent years, our record Vs those so-called “big name” European sides aren’t that bad really. Cos it always took the British sides to send us packing from CL.
The last time a non-English opposition that put us out of Champions League – PSV. Hardly the biggest name these days.
Anyone else as (or possibly more) concerned about Gallas’s injury than Cesc’s? Don’t get me wrong, Cesc is still the man. But, as numerous people have pointed out several times, the one spot where Arsenal have HUGE depth is creative, attacking central midfielders. Nasri’s recent run of form combined with this existing depth makes me less worried about Cesc’s injury than Gallas’s. Because we are THIN at the back. Sol can play every other match for now (maybe he can play twice in a week here and there, but not for an extended number of weeks), but that means moving Song to CB every other match, which hurts us at the DM spot b/c he is our only true DM. Or, even worse, Sylvestre will get a game!
No way.
Cesc is the engine, I think we needed him for an unblemished run in, and chance at the league.
Gallas, we have played without him for how long now, he just came back…
and we did just fine thanks.
I’d prefer to have a fit Gallas at the back, but not over having Cesc in the team.
He is our ONLY STAR PLAYER. Stars win big games.
We can cope without Cesc for a match, but for the rest of the year, that is a difficult task…
Just cause someone’s not famous doesn’t mean they aren’t talented or can’t produce the goods.
Stardom does not mean the same thing as talent. The English tabloid media has made a star out of Walcott, is he crucial for the team’s success?
Is Alex Song a ‘star’? Is Vermaelen a ‘star’? You apparently think not, as you think Cesc is our only one, but there’s no way even you can deny how important they are to Arsenal.
100% agree CG.
The irony here is when Man U lost Rooney to injury, Stag pointed out their Bolton result, seemingly have total faith that Man U aren’t an one man team.
When the similar thing happened to us, all a sudden he’s saying “we can cope without cesc for a match, but for the rest of the the year is a difficult task”.
wtf.
Andez, I said if United win the league now, they deserve it… because without Rooney, it won’t be as easy.
Folks pointed to Rooney injury and said they’ll struggle with the remaining games, I pointed out they won 4-0 at Bolton.
I know you hate it when I point out facts…
If you have faith that us losing 3 of our BEST players is not a big deal thats wonderful… especially since they are among the most experienced we have as well…
But it doesn’t really matter long-term anyway, because the year has been a success for the ARSENAL FC… regardless of what happens going forward.
To staggy boy, you aint a star till the press says so! ;-)
pretty simple really, WHEN it matter MOST, star players RISE TO THE OCCASION… on the big stage.
I remember Cesc coming on for a 20 minute period earlier in the year and WINNING the game for us, going off injured.
Can’t think of ANYONE in our team that is like that.
I know there are folks that think our team is full of great players, but most youngsters WILT under great pressure.
How have we done in the “BIG GAMES” this season?
Please tell me.
Both games against United, both games against Chelsea.
I know … you don’t like facts… we all WANT us to win at Barcelona, but there will be WHOM in the line-up with the experience of WINNING these big games?
“STAR”… regardless of what hte media says Fred, is… someone who could start on just about any other team.
We don’t have many like that… and STAR means playing to your potential or ABOVE it, in the moments when it counts most.
While its been a great season so far, and of course we still have a chance, and anything can happen… and all the other cliches…
we have not played well in BIG GAMES this year, because we have no stars, and lack the experience of winners.
Just my opinion.
You can say we are FULL of STARS in the team, in your mind, we probably are.
But we had HENRY, BERGKAMP, VIEIRA, ADMAS, COLE, these were star players that took the pressure off everyone else.
How about Nasri, Arshavin, Vermaelen, and Bendtner all stepping up to give us a 5-0 Champions League victory after we threw away the first game 2-1?
at home, against a lesser side…
was that not “expected”, or were we underdogs at home to Porto?
Interesting to see the way Barcelona seemed to make excellent use of the big pitch. We should learn from that. It’s the type of game you need to see a second time, and thereby dispassionately dissect how Barca so effectively played keep-ball for soooooooo long.
Ummm, I think its because they always do that to errr…. lesser teams!
They owned the ball, we couldn’t keep it.
It could have been in a parking lot, it wouldn’t have mattered.
AND, they still didn’t win!
Can’t wait for the return leg.
Arshavin…Bendtner…Rosicky
…Diaby…..Song…..Nasri
Clichy..Verme..Campbell..Sagna
………..Almunia
Walcott, Denilson, Eboue, Sly, Eduardo(?)
It’s injury dependant. And Arsene may want to keep things tighter so he may be tempted to sacrifice Arsh or Rosicky for an Eboue or Denilson.
What’s the quality of Barca’s backup CB’s? Will Yaya be played at CB?
Not so sure about Arshavin but the rest looks likely. I wouldn’t mind Eboue playing tho.
I dunno… Call me crazy but I think I would start Denilson on today’s evidence. Hang on.. Hear me out.
Sol I think needs to start against Wolves. We have been told he can’t play 2 in one week and he would I think be very slow for Barca anyway. Which means Song can play CB. Denilson was good when he came on today. His main weakness is his physical deficiency and Barca is not the side to exploit that in him. He keeps is tidy (for the most part) and may help in retaining possession which on today’s game we were severely lacking.
CG- On arshavin I can feel your doubts. We looked so much better when he came off. No chance of a magic moment from Eboue like we have with him but at least we win back the ball a bit more. Though I would still go with the russian. I think he’s too good and capable of too much to not play him.
ps- Probably the first time I’m saying this since he left, but we could really have used Aleks Hleb today. That man was a master at retaining possession and would have suited us perfectly… Anyway.. This is not meant to be a cue for Mazza to step up to the plate. Just mentioning it.
Not much sleep for Ozi, I fear….
This was, for me, by far, the best I’ve seen Denilson play. The boy has skills and seemed free from the fear of being crushed by the big lugs of the English game. By comparison, Diaby looked hurried and unsure. Alex Hleb would’ve been a huge boost for us, as he was when Stuttgart drew Barca in their opening leg….(Of course they lost the return leg at the Camp Nou 4-0…)
How can Cesc be talking about a broken leg? Get a freakin’ x-ray. The drama before the match (“will he/won’t he”) was too much and now this….
Overall, my impression is that it’s one thing to have the skills and the quality and another to be able to produce them at speed. The pace of Messi (thankfully tame tonight), Alves, and Pedro were too much for our boys (though Clichy looked up to it pace-wise).
We were lucky in a great number of ways (yet their goals were hugely frustrating) and we, kind of, live to fight another day….
He got an x-ray, it was “inconclusive”… you KNOW when something is not right… when something is broken, and he thinks its broken.
I’ll pray its not, but it doesn’t look good.
Pretty much everybody looked “hurried and unsure” for about 70 minutes, except maybe Nasri!
They KILLED us, had all the possession, and still drew.
LOL
They know what we usually feel like now!
Ozi, fair enough about Denilson. I’m still no fan of his, but I guess I’d be OK w/ him starting the return leg, in light of his performance today and our needs for Song to play elsewhere.
As for Arshavin, I wasn’t saying I prefer Eboue over him- I just think he may not be able to play the next week or so b/c of the knock he picked up today. And that I felt it’s not the end of the world since Eboue can fill in.
If Song is at CB, then yes, Denilson will have to play.
What’s the option?
Even if Sol plays with Vermaelen… I think Denilson will play, based on his good match today.
But who knows?!
ARSENE KNOWS!
He knows we can’t play like that again and move on in the CL!
I would imagine Yaya Toure would be one of the two CB’s for Barcelona.
I believe he’s played there before.
All in all I did enjoy the football being played and if they had walked away with 4-0 I would have silently clapped that Barca team off all the way from here. Some of the La Liga games I’ve seen do come close and all this stuff about EPL being this popular, I think the gap would be far less if it wasn’t for the difference in languages.
-La Liga being broadcast with English commentary
-A team or two being bought by a rich bunch to challenge the top 2 there a la Chelsea/City
If these 2 changes were to happen, I can see La Liga overtaking EPL as the most watched league in the world.
Needless to say, I would still hunt the net for an Arsenal vs Thugs stream if Barca-Real was being being shown on TV at the same time :P
La Liga IS broadcast in English, and if you are saying that is a negative? how? or why?
and are you now saying that Chelsea/City being bought by Billionaires is a “good thing” for English Football?
Because I think I’m the only one on here that’s ever was of that opinion, (or expressed it)
Competition is GOOD.
There is no competition in La Liga… they do need more teams involved against the two RICH teams.
Never seen it broadcast in English. And it is a good thing if it is. They need to market it better then (or I need to look harder probably).
Yes competition is entertaining. Entertainment breeds popularity. So in that sense the billionaires have benefitted English football as whole. The doubts have always been there on the long term financial health of these clubs though. And that has the potential of being DISASTROUS! A few people are shockingly blind to that very sinister possibility- even with what has happened to the likes of Leeds and Pompey in recent times.
OK, well, here in the US, every league is broadcast in English!
Pompey was nothing like Leeds, they didn’t spend wildly on player for insane money… there are no big stars in there team.
It was poor management, from the top down, and those that SCREWED the club, are GONE, and the fans and players are left to suffer the consequences.
Either way, the fundamental cause is unmanageable debts which a lot of foreign investors condemn their clubs to.
Add Crystal Palace and possibly West Ham to taht list Ozi.
Palace aren’t in the Prem, and West Ham … aren’t relegated yet.
who was the foreign investors for Crystal Palace?
Never heard of that.
Uhhh, I believe we were talking about debt here, and you don’t need to be foreign-owned to accumulate that.
I guess you weren’t aware, but just like Pompey, Palace were also docked 10 pts earlier this season for going into administration. Just cause they aren’t in the Prem does not mean it doesn’t count.
And West Ham, in case you somehow were also unaware of that as well, have been in dire straits financially for YEARS. They are teetering on the edge, and will have to sell, sell, SELL this summer even if they stay up. And that Sheff Utd. legal decision didn’t help either.
ozi said FOREIGN INVESTMENT was a REASON.
CP had none that I know of.
I am well aware they were docked, but again… there is bad management all over the place, it doesn’t equate to BUYING PLAYERS for more than you can afford.
Palace are not in the PREM, they don’t spend WILDLY on players… so that means PISS POOR MANAGEMENT.
There are a number of teams in lower divisions that get docked and go into administration.
It has ZERO to do with teams getting a new owner and spending wildly.
Its a COMPLETELY different animal.
Yeah, and piss poor management results in debt. Debt is debt, do you think the bank cares how you ended up with it?
—————————————-
“there is bad management all over the place, it doesn’t equate to BUYING PLAYERS for more than you can afford.”
Buying players for more than you can afford IS mismanagement as well, so how is one form of poor management different from another?
Also, no Palace don’t spend as much on players as PL teams… but guess what: they ain’t in the Prem, which means they bring in a lot less too. They can still spend above their means without spending at PL levels, which is obviously what happened.
I doubt you know what happened to Crystal Palace.
I doubt many fans of the team know.
Spending wildly with big foreign investment is COMPLETELY different to being mismanaged in the 1st Division.
Amidst all the excitement of our game, I only just now realized that inter beat CSKA 1-0 at San Siro. That one’s by no means over either.
?!!!?!!??!!!!!!?
Really?
I had to catch my breath after this game… in which
so much happened in the game, I might have to rewatch parts of it!
Can BOTH teams LOSE in a 2-2 draw?
OK, seriously… first 20 minutes or so, were an absolute EMBARRASSMENT.
I have never in my life seen an Arsenal team dominated like that. We could not take the ball off them, and quite frankly, it could have been 4 or 5 goals to NONE. We barely had possession, it was like 70 – 30%.
Almunia was excellent in the first half, and we were lucky that they did not put away at least 1 or 2 of the numerous chances.
You could not have watched that 1st half and thought we belonged on the pitch with Barcelona. No way.
Add to that, Arshavin getting injured, Gallas getting injured, and Cesc getting a yellow, ruling him out of the 2nd leg, and… there couldn’t be anything good coming out of the match tonite.
HOW WAS IT 0-0 at half?
So, I figured it had to get at least a bit better for us in the 2nd half.
19 seconds in… (or 22?)… and Almunia undoes everything he did in the first half and GIVES Ibrahimovic a goal.
Then the onslaught resumes, and BOOM, 2-0… they are just toying with us…
again, at that point… there could not have been many people who
a) thought we had a prayer
b) thought we belonged on the pitch tonite with Barca
c) weren’t hoping we just didn’t get humiliated by 3 or more goals.
Oh, but the footballing gods… they are a funny bunch.
Theo on for Sagna… (at first it appeared to be Nasri, and I was like, WTF!!! he was our best player)… and Theo was actually a big part of the turn around… he came on, changed the match, and when he got his chance he didn’t screw around, he SHOT EARLY, and beat Valdes.
Game ON.
That changed everything… after that we were in the match.
Pique’ gets a yellow, and he is out for the next match, I thought, OK, not even with Cesc being out of the return…
THEN… ALL HELL BREAKS LOOSE!
The 2nd goal… CHANGED THE MATCH, and unfortunately, THE SEASON for ARSENAL as well.
Puyol takes a red after a very good link up by Arsenal, he had to get a penalty and a red there…
And somehow, after being totally DOMINATED for most of the match,
Cesc steps up, scores the penalty, ties the match… and BREAKS HIS LEG?!
We get a draw, they have both their CB’s out for the return…
we lose CESC for the SEASON (if its like he said and Wenger said)
we lose GALLAS for the SEASON…
and Arshavin looks like he’ll be out for a while as well.
WE LOSE 2-2!
Barcelona HAVE to feel like they lost 2-2 as well…
and I guess the footballing world win… as we all got to see
an on the edge of your seat… biting your fingernails, cringe worthy, and at the end thrilling draw…
exhausted…
deflated in that we might have lost our BEST player for the rest of the season (and the WC for him if its a break)… and two other VERY influential players in our team in Arshavin and Gallas.
I think this match really dented any hopes to win the league… and
I think they will beat us down pretty easily at the Nou Camp… even with no 1st choice CB’s…
But… it was great to watch…
Ozi I too was impressed with how Barca harried in numbers on their feet rather than taking the flying tackle approach. One benefit of this was they escaped yellow cards and incurred only free kicks for their fouls. It’s fair enough too, tackling whilst staying on your feet is generally safer than sliding in.
What I do wonder is ‘can they do it again’? Can Barca pull out another commanding performance in the return. You’d be tempted to say yes, but football often isn’t that simple. Even Pep called it their best away performance in the CL. Did they blow it? They should have walked away with a 2 goal win.
Spot on. They have the capability no doubt. But I don’t think we’ll let them. But then again, like you say, it is never that simple. The return leg could turn on any tiny moment. If we match Barca’s energy and harrying at the Nou camp and as a result see more of the ball* then we have every chance of going through. People are going on about their lack of CB’s but we need the ball to take advantage of them. In any case, I think our loss today was bigger than theirs injury/suspension wise (Cesc, Arshavin and Gallas).
*I don’t think I have ever seen us this dominated possession-wise. 30-70 it was at one stage.
I think you’ll find they can repeat – and then some.
Barcelona at home are like they were tonight – on steroids.
Next week could become seriously embarrassing. I’m talking 5 or 6 nil here.
I agree Mazza, it has the definite possibility to get UGLY.
It could get ugly, or we could eek out a win. You may have a hunch, but you just can’t know for sure.
yeah, I don’t really think its very likely we eek out a win, without Cesc, Gallas, and Arshavin…
makes it more difficult, and they are HOME, where they are even more dominant, and we are medicore on the road.
Yes, we could eek out a win, but it doesn’t REALLY matter. We played an exciting game today, and we still have an exciting league run in…
Beating Barca would be great, but its already been a very positive season for AFC.
“For the life of me I cannot see how Ibrahimovic is worth both Eto and all that cash. Eto was a proven goal scoring machine. I believe if it is not broke, why fix?”
____________________________
That’s the question Arthur. I too was astonished at the deal in every way. Perhaps there’s a number of factors – Eto ageing, Eto’s inter-personal isues at Barca, the need to keep the Barca sharp-end fresh, the need for the replacement to be similarly ‘mega’, and seemingly a desire to alter the frontline and bring in an aerial dynamic.
Ummm, Ibra scored twice… how many do you want him to score? 5?
That’s not the issue. No one is saying Ibra’s bad. It’s just that when you win a treble, and have 3 players scoring 30 goals in a season (Henry, Messi, Eto’o, with Iniesta pulling the strings) your attack can’t get much better. So why change it? Why give up a 30 goals in all competitions striker who clearly fits well with the attack? And all that cash?
The only thing I can possibly think is unrest in the dressing room.
that has been said… obviously, he has issues… or creates unrest.
he had to go, and they didn’t want him on the team.
Ibra, is his equal in many respects.
Ibra is NOT Eto’o equal in ANY respect.
When he reaches Etos 1 goal every 2 games scoring level or is prominent in a CL winning side then he can talk.
He’ll likely be on the winning side this year…
Last year at Barca, Eto ended with 30 goals…
This year at Inter he has 10…
Last year at Inter
Ibra had 25 goals…
This year at Barca
he has 15
Hmmm.
Seems to me they both have 40 goals in the past 2 years, but yes,
OBVIOUSLY, Ibrahimovic is having a MUCH better year this year than Eto.
By the way, how frequently and how quickly were Barca dispossessing us when we got the ball. EPL teams incl us should learn from this. They almost never had to go to ground for this either and no leg-breaking tackles (a bit ironic seeing as Cesc might have a broken fib). Constant harrying by their forward line and mids.
That is how to stop the other team (even a team like us) from playing football without being anti-football.
They were excellent. They didn’t really foul much the entire game, and WE played a bit of ANTI-FOOTBALL! (in your world) by taking out players legs, instead of the ball.
But what are you to do, when you can’t get the ball away from your opponent?!
You foul!
Eh? You’re saying we went out there to kick Barca into submission? To foul them cause they’re better? That is what your beloved Sam Allardyce school of thinking teams set out to do to us…
Ummm, no… I said we FOULED them, on more than one occasion, because we couldn’t get the ball off them.
Just like it happens to us. because they are better!
We didn’t target them and deliberately set out to foul them. They were too quick on some occasions (and some of those tackles weren’t even fouls btw- Cesc for example). Anyway, compare that to the rotational kicking htat goes on against us…
Did you see our defence and mids taking it in turns to kick the hell out of Messi (or anyone else for that matter)? THAT is what happens to us.
I too heard Cesc’s leg might be broken. Rooney picks up a knock, you think we’re getting some luck, then Gallas and Fab go out. Chelsea must be happy, but even they’ve been devastated by injury at times this year. All I can say is, lace up the boots, Sol, cause you’re in for the run-in.
Cesc broken leg would be horrible. I really hope not. And if true, I really hope he at least plays in the world cup. He deserves it and this would be very cruel. On the same note, I hope England doesn’t miss out on Rooney on the WC. I HATE him with all my heart and I almost always root against the English national team but Rooney does deserve to play after the work they’ve put in and the audience as a whole would be being almost short-changed if Cesc and Shrek were to sit out.
Hopefully Cesc’s scan comes back clean (you shoulda just got off the pitch man!!) and Shrek is out all the way till after the season is over.
yes, why is he out there limping around and getting involved in the play if his leg is BROKEN?
That is idiotic.
Anyone else look at Ibrahimovic and consider if this is the type of forward that Bendtner can become? There are the obvious similarities in the Scandanavians, both tall and strong without being gladitorial (ala Drogba), a certain laconic element in their style that borders disinterest, both bigmen who play football and read the game. Being big they’re not particularly quick in a straight line nor on the turn.
I do find it interesting that Pep was prepared to pay big to replace the razor-sharp goal machine Eto with the laconic bigman Ibrahimovic. One can only assume that he desired his team to have a footballing bigman as an option up front. That’s seriously interesting and I like it.
I guess that should be his ambition. But Ibrahimovic has got some AMAZING ball control. He can do some things with the ball on the field that very few players can. I don’t think that Bendy has that in him, unfortunately. Not doubting our boys potential as a whole, but when it comes to ball control and dribbling and the like, Ibrahimovic is in the top drawer in world football and these aren’t things that can easily be learned, if at all.
NO Ibrahimovic has always been far more technically gifted than Bendtner, they are big, the similarities end there for me.
For the life of me I cannot see how Ibrahimovic is worth both Eto and all that cash. Eto was a proven goal scoring machine. I believe if it is not broke, why fix it?
To be fair, he does give them a whole new dimension. A plan B that they could really have used in e.g. the semis against Chelsea last season.
But all in all, I think Inter got the better end of that deal. Zlatan has been quite decent for Barca all in all (esp at the start of the season) but prolly not worth Eto’o plus all that cash.
I agree with Ozi… Ibra has GREAT ball control, and Bendtner doesn’t have much at all. That puts them on completely different levels.
Eto’o obviously was an issue at Barcelona, or they wouldn’t have made that deal.
Ibra is a very good replacement for him, just a different type of great scorer.
Our little skipper fears a broken leg, oh dear, but what a great player he is turning in to.
http://www.eveningstar.co.uk/content/eveningstar/news/story.aspx?brand=ESTOnline&category=News&tBrand=ESTOnline&tCategory=xDefault&itemid=IPED31+Mar+2010+23%3A26%3A44%3A760
If he is out for a number of the remaining games or even all of them we’ll miss him enormously. His goals, vision, general play, calmness, and emerging leadership are at the heart of our game. That said, Nasri’s emergence provides a serious option as cover.
Surprised, I am, that Rosicky didn’t feature.
The injury mix is going to be very important in the remaining games particularly if Fabregas is absent. Arshavin is mercurial – frustrating yes, intermittent yes, but capable of the killer blow against anyone and hence we need him. Rosicky and Nasri fit the passing-DNA that makes this team hum so we need them too. Walcott can have impact like we saw today, he isn’t imo in-tune with this team but he can be influential as an event player. A sub’s role seems well fitting at this stage. So if those guys are all fittish then we can front up and give the team meaningful options. Throw in Diaby – who has improved and will in some games play really well and with Song in his holding role we’re still looking ok.
The issue gets murkier once you consider Gallas is OUT. Campbell can play in some games and will be a really good option in tandem with Verm. However playing every remaining game is probably too big for big Sol. So we might have to mix-n-match a CB combo in some games to rest him. That means Song moving back and vacating his DM role, the overall impact of that is to weaken us structurally and defensively. We may be able to ride it out if we can get enough offensive threat happening.
What a game. It was our turn to be West Ham for that 2-2 draw we had earlier this season.
Those Barca fans must feel totally bewildered! How could they let us back in the game. I was a little surprised how tame we were in the first half. We didn’t get at them to try and stop them at all.
I have to hold my hand up and say well played to Bendtner who laid on the first goal for Theo with a deft pass inside left-back (nothing flukey about it), and aimed the header for Cesc to win the penalty. He’s starting to shield, turn and pass, providing the Van P. pivot our attack has been missing.
The return leg is going to be interesting to say the least. Suddenly an upset is almost a possibility.
JUST IN:
William Gallas is now out for the remainder of the season – per Arsene Wenger.
Cesc is having a scan of his knee.
AA23 – doesn’t look good either.
High drama at The Emirates.
Slightly ridiculous number of yellow cards favouring Barcelona – evened up with a red near the end against Puyol.
This tie is NOT over. Barcelona will be missing both their CB’s. I’m a little sanguine on Fabregas’ absence thanks to the emerging form of Nasri. Hopefully we’ll have Arshavin & Rosicky available – so we have clever offensive creativity as options.
Nasri, the guy is really starting to find his feet after the leg break. He seems to have more pace and power now and has good tight control and offensive drive for goal.
Fabregas, in recent games he’s stepped up and scored 2 massive penalties. He really is becoming the real deal – world class. He didn’t have a great game today in general play yet he still influenced proceedings and held his nerve on the big ocassion – no choking.
Walcott/Almunia, the key words are intuitive and spontaneous. When they don’t have to ‘think’ they can be deadly effective. Absolutely key goal by Walcott and well taken…. yet after that you could see when it came to general play he’s just not on the same planet. Almunia, a string of brilliant reaction saves that stopped the score being 4-0 in the first half.
When the game was 2-0 to Barca it could have ended up a humiliation. Let’s not kid ourselves, they were in the zone and looking hungry and superior. The fact it didn’t perhaps shows ‘green shoots’ of genuine maturing in our team. We didn’t fold, Walcott (as frustrating as he is to me) caused a response. Then we surged forward and won and nailed a professional penalty.
Before we lampoon our boys too much let’s swap shirts. If that was us totally dominating a game, making the opposition chase shadows, creating multiple chances, missing plenty, going 2-0 up, looking absolutely comfortable, and then ending up 2-2 and losing your two CB’s and captain for the return leg would you be upbeat?????????????????????? No way!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! We’ve weathered a storm. It wasn’t pretty, it didn’t showcase our passing game for large chunks, yet we’re in the tie. A win, any win, any how, and we’re through.
We all knew this would be a massive challenge. The worlds best team at the end of a season when the injuries are biting (albeit some predictable). But we’re in it. And truth is when it went 2-1 and our passing started to stick Barcelona started to look wobbly. If Fabregas didn’t get injured in taking the penalty we had a chance to apply even more pressure for goal 3. Football isn’t gymnastics – you win on goals not points for artistic merit. That’s cruel but that’s football. We know it only too well.
Good post. Very well said. I slightly disagree with them not being up for it because of us coming back into it. I’mm quite sure they’ll be up for ‘making things right’. That said though, I think the comeback will see our confidence grow so that we can hopefully match them a bit better like we did after we were 2-0 down and got the lucky break.
I’m never one to complain about refs, but he was a complete joke tonight. I’m amazed he gave the penalty.
It was bad. Fab’s card was ridiculous. But it’s also a case in point, because he was not the reason why the match turned out the way it did.
How did the match turn out the way it did? ;-)
I’m sure if we put our heads together we can pin point core reason. Hmm……
It’s pretty hard to deny the power of your half-time rants, at this point. Honestly, it makes as much sense as anything else.
Are you seriously disputing that penatly?!!
That was stone wall, in fact I think Puyol knew exactly waht he was doing, he was trying to stop cesc getting a clean strike unfortunately for him his leg trap was too obvious.
What was a poor decision though, was to ignore Clichy’ foul on Messi first half, another stonewall penalty.
For those who belive Arsenal are a good side, and capable of playing better, no doubt it was a disappointing performance from our boys tonight.
For those who believe Arsenal are an “average side”, they should be very happy about the result. Afterall, not too many average sides being able to come from 2 goals down to draw the defending champs Barcelona.
Yeah, whose ever heard of an average side, coming back to draw a much better club? That almost never happens…twice in just a few days.
I don’t know how regularly it happened.
But when it did happen, their fans (average sides) were happy.
Am I wrong?
No, of course not. You’re 100% correct. We’re all happy with the result.
Just as Birmingham fans were happy over the weekend.
Just as Hammers fans were happy last fall, clawing back at 2-2.
Just as Spurs fans were happy last season, after stealing that 4-4.
Yep, it’s absolutely possible to be drawn, average and happy.
Nice one Andez! you have put it into perspective beautifully :-)
Unfortunately Mongers will never be happy in what should be a good result in their eyes but they will rather be happy that we looked average ;-)
I had to go fly after twelve minutes and missed the rest of the game. Is that some bullshit or what? What did I miss? Hopefully, I can catch a replay.
Hmmm… what did you miss?
The most incredible 15 minutes of goalkeeping I’ve seen, courtesy of Manuel Almunia.
A brilliant strike from Zlatan, despite our defensive and GK lapses on the goal.
Zlatan coming out for the one, the only, the legendary, Arsenal’s all-time leading goalscorer Thiery Henry!
A goal made by blistering speed by Walcott.
A foul on Cesc by the Barcelona captain, Puyol, which led to a straight red card and a PK for captain fantastic, which he duly converted, though he may have broken his leg in the process.
PS: Almunia coming out for Ibra’s first goal is hands down the MOST ridiculous piece of goalkeeping I have seen at this stage of this competition before.
It wasnt a human mistake or a fumble or anything accidental at all, it just gives you a window into his thought process really. Extremely poor.
Barca will surely target him in the return. They will probably shoot less and have more drawn out plays, second balls and what not to force Almunia to actually think.
Once Almunia thinks, we are f$cked!
Fred, Almunia’s shortcomings are well documented. For the balance of the season, we can only hope he isn’t challenged with too many decision making plays.
I repeat:
Manny was great to day bar his error but had Vermaelen being defending zonal instead of being drawn out of postion by Messi Manny wouldn’t have had to make that decision. Bar that error he was fantastic. For 45 mins Manny was the best goalie in the world :-D ;-)
So in other words you agree he is an extremely poor decision maker?
I dont get your objection.
True that on Vermaelen. Got caught out positionally. But he is one of those players you don’t worry too much about repeating the same mistakes. I’d like to see why he got caught out and analyse it, seemed to me from one of the replays he was covering for another player but it’s a bit hazy right now.
Ozi he did it twice for both goals. He got drawn out trying to “mark” Messi. That was not his job if it means he has to leave his core central defensive zone. He should have let Messi drift to be marshalled by the MF. For the 1st goal we were DF the MF and DF were bunched, no space in between DF and MF. The space was in between DF and GK, instead of guarding that space Vermaelen was drawn to Messi who was retreating into the MF area.
Great player but two DF lapses that did not help the cause yesterday.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/mattslater/2010/03/arsenals_suitors_start_saving.html
Off topic but very important.
Half time rant does the job again.
Seriously though, I had zero expectation of getting through this tie so I wanted to see us play at our supposed level against a ‘footballing’ team. No fouls, no physical play. What happened? We got totally outplayed and totally outclassed.
This is no accident, we have a team full of slow, thick players like Song and Diaby. Song being slow and Diaby being thick. Diaby was awful, a complete embarrassment.
Thank god we pulled it back to 2-2. Hoepfully now everyone might forget what happened tonight, apart from Arsene obviously.
I also admit I didn’t think we stood a chance when we were 2-0 down. Thank god the players did.
last couple years, fans complained we couldn’t win ugly, so this year we’re winning games unArsenal….yet, some fans still are complaining about the style…
……these youngsters rose to the occasion – fought back & showed determination. Those on the pitch at the final whistle don’t deserve any criticism.
I would say that Barca’s defense is average, overshadowed by the strength of their attack.
One thing we’ve never lacked is character. We always tend to come on strong late on, and I wasn’t surprised we had them going at the end.
It’s a quality issue. When both teams are fresh, we look gears below the top teams.
Song was our best player in the first half barring Big Al of course.
I cannot see why you choose him to vent your derision on.
Yep he was caught out twice in the 2nd half but the fact he was playing as a lone CB with Vermaelen been drawn out of his rightful zone area by Messi.
Considering the tie could have literally been over in the first 15 minutes there is lots to be happy about. We’re still in it, just need to get a 3 point result on the road at the Nou Camp…
That or a 3-3 draw ;)
Lets face facts, we were extremely lucky to not leave this game with a 5-0 deficit.
Walcotts goal was flukey and the penalty was very fortunate. All in all, the ref was way too card happy. In that instance it worked for us.
Personally, I think we should be very thankful we even have hope in this tie considering we were playing with a brainless keeper and a nonsensical DM.
Fabregas wasnt too useful and to be honest, am not too bothered he is missing the away game. It would at least cut out the press hype and all.
Bottom line, we were thoroughly outclassed …. we need to do much better than this. It was like watching Arsenal v. Generic League One team … with us being the generic League One team.
Sometimes the best team doesn’t win.
I thought you said ‘geriatric’ for a minute. We just looked so slow in comparison to them.
Come on dude. Manny was great to day bar his error but had Vermaelen being defending zonal instead of being drawn out of postion by Messi Manny wouldn’t have had to make that decision. Bar that error he was fantastic. For 45 mins Manny was the best goalie in the world :-D ;-)
Denilson did really well when he was introduced he broke up more play than all of our other MF, didn’t give the ball away… simply did a very good job.
Drink some Kool Aid and enjoy the comeback and keep your fingers crossed for the next leg.
At HT I said Almunia was MOTM. I think Nasri is probably the best choice at FT.
Messi not too much of a factor tonight. Credit due to Gael Clichy
And Vermaelen too. He was playing quite central Messi. We did well in that regard!
Get out of jail free card used up. Now we need to whip out the “go straight to GO” card. It’s a football game and THERE IS a tiny chance. We dont have cesc, they dont have any CB. But we will need to see some more of the ball if we can take advantage of that. Nasri was IMMENSE. tracked back beautifully. Rarely lost the ball (Diaby was unfortunately shocking in that regard). Denilson looked decent I gotta say.
We WILL be high on confidence. And we’ll need it to take advantage of their CB situation. Theo needs to start. They don’t defend deep like the EPL sides. Running is the one thing he is good at and he is going to have a lot of space against a Barca side hell bent on attacking.
This game is going to live long long into the memory. Enjoy it!
Denilson did not look decent he was fantastic today… no I mean INCREDIBLE
When he came on for Gallas I thought Oh no! not Denilson. But I was presently surprised he broke up a lot of play and didn’t lose the ball at all. Great game from him.
Back from the dead is absolutely right.
REturn leg – no cesc, no puyol, no pique.
should be fun!!
Iniesta probably back.
Their midfield could get better?!?!
vibe4arsenal Reply:
March 29th, 2010 at 3:02 pm
“I can’t see Cesc sitting out Barca even on one leg, I expect he’ll be out there.”
Called it! ;-)
Aren’t you Nostradamus for calling that one? :p
;-)
I think Puyol is out for the return… right? That could be big.
Yes.
2-2. Back from the death. Let’s get Mazza to beat the dead horse again at half time next week.
What a crazy match!
Beautiful ball by Bendy, great finish by Theo.
Something, at least.
As I’ve said before, when it’s about using his reflexes, Manny’s all right.
When it’s about using his brains, fecked.
Yep. Good enough at shot stopping. Bad at crosses, positioning, decision-making.
To be fair to Big Al, it was good decision making behind the majority of his saves in the first half. In particular the one when he came rushing out to parry Iniesta’ shot. If he had not made that decision Iniesta would have had a whole view of the goal goal at his mercy.
His saves far out wayed his error give him credit.
Yikes, 19 min’s and 25 sec’s before we put 3 passes together and made a little headway. Barcelona played a commanding first half, incredible possession, lot’s of chances – good chances, a goal keeper that played out of his skin….. sounds like us!!!
Nasri has been our best attacker by far. I’m impressed with the way his game is emerging finally post-injury. Dodgy (bad) tackle by Arshavin that got him carded. Cesc’s card looked a poor call, yikes. Interesting to see the quickness by CL ref’s to go for the yellow.
We’ve been pounded. Almunia excellent. Character building stuff ;-)
But we’ve managed to get in to the game more after minute 19.
This is what the EPL feel like playing us…..
Mooney: Talked too soon Kiwi :)
It seems like we get out classed any top team now, regardless of whether they are physical, technical or otherwise. Maybe time to call a spade a spade with this team. VERY AVERAGE.
It is still 0-0 you know.
Because Manny pulled half a dozen saves out of his arse.
there u go again mazza. talking about kicking someone when he’s down. u just can’t wait can u?
2-0, he should be happy now.
It’s cold in London.
Or is that kicking the temperature while it’s down?
lol!
MONGER! ;-)
And now Fab will be rested for the League run-in. Great.
Barca have run riot so far, it is a miracle that it is still 0-0 at HT.
“The warmest man in London.”
Manny’s on-fire.
Well, we’ve been on the wrong end of lots of possession, no goals, then getting scored on with a quick counter. Being hopeful, maybe we can get one of those back here.
The XI on the pitch are the best uninjured XI we have. Excellent.
Keita gets the start. I was hoping for Toure. We should be able to cope.
I’m in the GDC, waiting for friends….
and OFF TOPIC…
ROONEY… out for 2 to 4 WEEKS.
This re-opens the door, for both Arsenal AND Chelsea.
If United win the league now, they deserve it.
Cesc starts, Henry is on the bench.
I like our line-up.
Sagna Gallas Vermaelen Clichy
our best back 4…
really NO expectations from what we will do today,
just going to sit back and watch, hopefully a good football match.
I say…
2-1 to Barcelona
So, um, you DO have an expectation. ;-)
yes Josh’s right, big mistake (to play at Wembley). One of the purposes was to generate more income. But it won’t help when you go out at group stage.
but now come to think of it, the decision to play at Wembley might be where the Emirates project idea was born – the board finally realized how many fans Arsenal could attract yet being kept out of door because of Highbury’s small capacity.
One highlight I remember vividly – a picture with Rivaldo (at the peak of his power, = Messi today, in terms of hype) dribbling with the ball, our old back 4, all 4 of them surrounded him right, left, front and behind. Talking about shutting down their main man!
I’m not sure if I recall this correctly – the Nou Camp tie I believe it was Alex Manninger in goal. It was the dream came true for him. He was a boyhood Barca fan.
I think Clichy will do fine against Messi and I’m not that worried about him. He will see tonight that Clichy matches up with him as well as anyone he’s ever played against. Clichy is just as quick and just as fast as Messi and Clichy will get close to him.
Clichy is really fast. In addition to allowing him to keep up w/ Messi, it also makes it easier to recover he makes a mistake. There may be better LB’s out there, but I agree that Clichy is a very good fit for Messi.
The idea that DAG posted above about using a RB is interesting too, but I think Clichy will handle him OK.
there’s also an extra motivation for Clichy. If he could handle Messi, it surely won’t hurt his prospect of making into France squad going to South Africa.
Sending a message to the France coach – hey if I can handle the best player in the world, I can handle anyone.
I remember that year we decided to play our European ties at Wembley. It was the biggest mistake ever.
I heard it was for 2-3 seasons… but yeah, I also heard it went terribly.
I went to the Fiorentina game that year. Right behind the goal when Batistuta scored. They played Abba “winner takes it all’ before the game, so naturally we lost.
Perhaps this isn’t news to people who’ve followed Arsenal longer than I have, but apparently we played Barca in the CL before that 2006 final. In the 99/00 season we were in the same group as them. They were 1st, Fiorentina 2nd, Arsenal 3rd, AIK (Sweden) 4th.
Results:
Camp Nou: Barca 1-1 Arsenal (Kanu)
Wembley: Arsenal 2-4 Barca (Bergkamp, Overmars)
Not saying it has any affect on this tie or anything, I just thought it was interesting.
From John Cross of the Mirror –
Word is the Cesc to start, Henry is on the bench and Gallas also will start.
More clarity on the Cesc situation – he is in the stating lineup. They will conduct one more on the field test during warm up to decide if he starts
Slightly off topic, but did anyone catch the Lyon/Bordeaux game yesterday. I must admit that I wasn’t a big fan of Chamakh, but he is definitely a big game player. He had one goal and could have had a few others if the keeper hadn’t made some big-time saves and he always seemed to be hustling. Could turn out well if Arsene does actually sign him.
A chance for Almunia to redeem himself. I remember Mad Jens went from zero to hero in that CL semi Vs Villreal a few years back (before going from hero to zero again after the final).
Almunia has a chance to become hero tonight.
But then if he f8ck up again, he would have a good chance to go down as the worst starting keeper of Arsenal history of all time, at least in Gooners’ mind.
For some reasons, I’m not so worried about Messi. Top team players relish the chance to play against top class player like him. From what I recall, Clichy did pretty well whenever Arsenal played against Man U at the past handling Ronaldo.
In fact, I don’t recall on too many occasions our defence were bothered by a skillful attacker.
What our defence fear most are the bulldogs, the physical guys like Drogba, Rooney, or even Kevin Davies, and.. hate to say that, but that’s how I honestly feel – someone like Adebayor.
“People, Arsenal fans, stop me and say: ‘Bob can you get your boots on and everything’. But I’ve said it before that Manuel is a really solid goalkeeper.
“He just has to take that final step to greatness. It’s about presence and it’s about being a body in the goal when you go into that goalmouth, commanding the area and even doing it in the warm-up where you just look as if you belong in there.
“Manuel has to take that one step further. I would agree at the moment that he has not taken that step but I think he is capable of taking it.”
– Double winning Arsenal Keeper and former GK Coach, Bob Wilson on Manuel Almunia
Hoping that Bob’s spirit invades the Spaniard’s torso.
Our line up options are ‘all’ good.
For me, our success will be depend on solid play from our GK and back 4.
I read this article written by Martin Keown on how to play Messi –
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1262384/How-stop-threat-majestic-Messi-Ex-Arsenal-defender-Martin-Keown-delivers-verdict-Barcelona-star.html
One of the interesting things he says is to put a right back on the left side in order to force Messi to his weaker foot. Its what Chelsea did with Boswinga two years ago.
Another match-up I’d like to see is Theo against Maxwell. Not suggesting we start Theo but bring him on midway through the second half. Maxwell is garbage as a LB and Theo’s pace could punish his lack of discipline. I think Alves would struggle with Arshavin as well. I think their fullbacks are both suspect. Likewise, I think their CB’s will struggle with Bendtner’s size. I could be wrong. We’ll see.
Interesting to see if Wenger starts Gallas or not. Sol looked a little slow on Saturday. Also, will Eboue or Sagna start. I’d like to see Eboue get the nod just so his dribbles give Barcelona something to think about.
Rosicky’s been fit for a while now and seems to be coming back to his best. He was looking to be involved in everything we did on Saturday. Will be watching this spot as well.
I don’t expect Fabregas to start but who knows? If Diaby is fit, to have him running at defenders will give Barcelona something else to think about as well. Fab can have a cameo like in the Villa game. Barca are so concerned about him so Fab not playing could have the same effect as Porto did in the last CL game.
I think Wenger should go for it and see if Barcelona can cope with a team that attacks them. I know the Emirates isn’t the greatest of atmospheres but it’s got to be wound up tonight. The whole world is going to be watching. I can’t see this game not living up to the hype.
cesc is fit…CMON ARSENAL!
Cesc passed fit.. maybe I can finally get a few hours sleep now… Football here in Perth can be on at the unholiest of hours
I haven’t seen any reports on Cesc passed fit (except for Spanish media speculation). It seems like it’ll be a last minute decision (as they say…), but maybe you guys have better sources….
Anybody else peeved that oddsmakers give the shortest odds on a Barca win tonight? All results are approx 2:1 but the bet on Barca to win pays slightly less (11/8).
Given our home results vs United and Chelsea I guess I can understand. Maybe it’s time to make the new stadium a bit of a fortress….
Did anybody, other than perhaps stagg, really expect there was any way on Earth Cesc would not play today?
Lol not really.. Right.. Game oNNNN!!!
ps- got ZERO sleep… anywayy…
So it looks like Rooney is out for the next 2-4 weeks. That means he misses – Chelsea, 2nd leg of Bayern, Man City, Tottenham.
Oh and Cesc has been cleared to play today.
Also Pique and Abidal were cleared to play but may not start.
DAG, many thanks (also) for your time and commitment. Great take on today’s event.
Most of us will be anxiously waiting to see physical status for Cesc and Gallas.
Liking the Bayern win over ManU, once the whistle blows anything is possible.
Which Arsenal team will show up?
Steve – I too am trying not to have too much expectation in this match. I am really hoping to just enjoy and it lives up to the hype. What I am worried about is that it doesn’t. So much expectation about two great attacking sides.
By the way are any of you in NYC? I think I am at least going to try and catch the first half at Nevada Smith’s amongst the NY Arsenal faithful.
Thanks for the preview DAG, which captures a lot of the excitement many are feeling around this tie. I’m trying to avoid carrying too much expectation into it and just hoping to watch a very nice match unfold.
Also, sorry if I ruffled some feathers or spoke for others in earlier threads….The quality of writing and the knowledge of many of the posters on this site AND the openness of the format make me feel that we can have some really good discussions on all matters Arsenal, and I just get a bit frustrated sometimes. Again, sorry….
And maybe it’s the same about our team….I like what AW said about critics of the team: “The opinions [of critics] are there to be changed and what changes the opinions is the performances. What is good in sport is that people assess continuously something that looks to be definite but actually is moving always. And what moves the opinions of people is how well we play.”
As for tonight, the drama around Cesc’s injury is a bit much: either he plays or he doesn’t. Likewise it will be very strange if Gallas is suddenly fit and starting tonight. Squad selection will be very interesting and I hope we put out a positive group and especially try to exploit their injuries down their left side (Iniesta and Abidal) with some pace there (Theo or Eboue). I’m confident Nasri and Diaby will play well, And now is the time to see exactly what Arshavin can give this team. Nine goals in all competitions with some recent very bad misses is rather paltry….but we all know that he can score some great ones and in bunches. It’s also a huge game for Bendtner to show that he can lead the line. Chamahk scored a solid goal last night and would’ve had another but for the brilliance of Hugo Lloris (who should be an obvious Arsenal target).
But that’s the future. For tonight, Andez said it all: “In Almunia we pray”. What a test for our back line and our entire team….Can’t wait.
Offtopic: A nice article about Alex Song. I do like these nice articles which give you an insight into player’s lives. A welcome change from the drivel that is present on 99% of articles.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/mar/31/alex-song-arsenal-influential
Alright, here goes nothing — we will play our hearts out, come close, then get picked off with a killer goal.
Praying otherwise…
Tossed and turned all night about this match up, but eventually the sandman took over; all I can remember is Rosicky slamming in the winner in extra time.
Almunia was unanimous MOTM – I woke up in a cold sweat.
That’s a nice dream to have though. So the term “cold sweat” if I may …is inappropriate.
When I use this term, its from some realization that causes deep concern.
So for my dream, I contemplated that the MOTM award was not likely, thus casting a shadow of uneasiness about a positive result.
Anyway, this being a blog site: ‘inappropriate’ has been clearly defined on subjects centering on racism, sexism, hatred commentary, and Spurs support.
Spurs support- Heh… To be fair, they have been playing some decent footy lately
They have, Ozi. Honestly, not having years and years of Spurs hatred bred into me, I really don’t have a problem admitting that I find them an entertaining side to watch.
This will end 1-0 to someone. And the Nou Camp will be a blood bath to someone. Quote me.
As for the legend stuff in the previous thread… I wasn’t even talking about how winning trophies make you legendary. All I was saying that it was nice to see ex players whom we lookup to still speak nicely about their ex club. That’s it. Somehow somewhere.. trophies are dragged in. Every single time. Why a trophy would mean “more” to a fan..”more” ok? before you all start calling me names .. than a player I will never ever understand. That plus the fact that its so hard to even appreciate something or praise someone without linking it to some achievement. Dont get it..not in football , not anywhere in life. But it happens , everywhere.
I think everyone expects a bloodbath at Nou Camp. To quote Mazza, “It could get Messi.”
But a clean-sheet for The Arsenal today? Now THAT is a bold prediction. I would be very pleasantly shocked.
Nice article
We forget that the last game between these two “beautiful” teams was a 1-0 till the 84th (?) min with the only goal coming from a set piece. :)
Anything can happen, but these are games you look forward to. I just hope all our players are up for it and we start with our strongest 11.
For some reason, I have been thinking about the score-lines from the Madrid matches. When that tie was first announced, I didn’t expect that the two legs would end 0-1, 0-0. So..part of me is thinking there might be a 0-0 and 1-0 result in these two matches with Barca. But when I look towards the net, I don’t see Lehmann and then I start having doubts :) Now even if there is a 0-0 result, it will be one of the most beautiful goalless results. Atleast that is what I hope.
I had been looking forward to this tie for so long that I had booked my wed afternoon off but found out today that I can’t get the afternoon off, nor will I be near a computer. So that may be good as I can pretend to watch the game live in the evening. Waited this long, so what’s another few more hours.
Bring on the Beauty. Come on Arsenal!!!!
All I can say is… Can’t f**king wait!